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RE: When?
Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2008 11:47 pm
by michaelbaldur
ORIGINAL: flipperwasirish
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: HansHafen
I am willing to pre purchase if financial concerns are going to substantially impact the game in a negative manner. I don't know what the suggested price is, but I imagine its $100 or more.
Keep up the great work. This is my favorite game.
This game definately needs a release party at the end so everyone can meet each other and have a drink.
Thanks, but about that party, ...
Me - Honolulu
Patrice - Marseilles
Rob Armstrong - Australia
David Heath - Colorado
Erik Rutkins - Vermont
Dan Hatchen - Saskatchewan
Lars & Terje - Norway
Michael Andersen - Denmark
Andy - Idaho
Jesper - Belgium?
Wosung - Germany
... I apologize to dozens of others I did not mention here.
The answer is obvious...everyone come to Connecticut.
P.S. Please bring wine and beer.
Thank you.
just send me a plane ticket .... [:D][:D]
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:05 am
by lomyrin
Actually, I am in San Diego, California
Lars
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:28 am
by wworld7
ORIGINAL: michaelbaldur
just send me a plane ticket .... [:D][:D]
If I could I would, alas I can't...
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:35 am
by Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: lomyrin
Actually, I am in San Diego, California
Lars
Ah, my sincere apologies.[:(] I meant to say Sweden[8|].
But this new information explains why you respond to my posts right after I make them. I always had this image of you being awake at 2 and 3 in the morning in Sweden.[X(]
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 6:33 am
by panzers
ORIGINAL: Froonp
ORIGINAL: cockney
ORIGINAL: SamuraiProgrammer
I also want to state that I would rather it be a complete, solid piece of software than to get it sooner.
As a developer myself, I know that you are more eager to finish the project than anyone on the planet. You also want to see it done right.
Hang in there. Keep up the excellent, dedicated work.
Kudos, Kowtows, and whatever else you can think of.
I, for one, believe in you.
TO MATRIX GAMES:
I can only speak for myself. I expect others will agree with my opinion, but that is their affair. Be that as it may, here is what I think...
Clearly, this is a business project that must show a profit at some point to be considered a success.
Clearly, this is a unique endeavor in that it is a FAITHFUL port of a complex wargame to a computer platform. Having not had the glimpse into the development process (ala Monthly Status Reports) for other games, it would be unfair to compare the professionalism of this project to any others. However, I can say that for the projects I have been involved in (in my 25 years of programming), this is the most organized project I have ever seen the details on. I have no doubts that it will succeed. It may take a little more time, but I believe in it.
I have too many times seen projects fall short of their possibilities due to rushing to meet a deadline. Please do not let that happen here. This project has the chance to be special. It has the prospect of greatness. Please do not pressure Steve to trim features or attention to details to rush it out the door.
However, I realize that business is business and without the economic concerns, many games would not be produced. I do not know what your arrangement with Steve is, nor is it any of my business. I do know that someone may start to feel a financial pinch because of these delays. Either Steve - because he is doing this instead of other lucrative employment - or Matrix Games - because they are paying more and longer than expected before release.
These things are intuitively obvious to any casual observer. The only question is how severe is the pressure to deviate from the 'golden path' that represents the perfect plan (i.e. if financial concerns were of no consequence). At some point these pressures will cause a change in the decision process. I hope this can be avoided.
Before these pressures get to a point where decisions detrimental to the quality of MWIF are being considered, I have a couple of suggestions that might help out. Obviously, these are only suggestions... the decisions are yours.
FIRST
I, for one, am willing to preorder and prepay for a copy of Matrix World In Flames at any time without a firm release date. This would be my way of 'putting my money where my mouth is' to help fund this development. Perhaps others would feel the same way.
SECOND
I recently saw a product released that had a different model for play testing.
Anyone who prepaid for their version was allowed to be a tester. This has benefits and drawbacks, I am sure. It may be a Pandora's Box. But once the copy protection scheme is in place, the danger of piracy is no worse than it would be for post release. This would give you cash flow and give the community a further sense of participation.
For the record, I am not making these suggestions to 'hurry up and get a copy of the game'. It may be months before I can find the time to play it anyway. I have not even submitted my name for playtesting because of that shortness of disposable time. It is an effort to find a way for the community to affirm that we believe that World In Flames is special, that Matrix World In Flames is going to be special, and that anything that will harm that specialness is bad. If, in order for that affirmation to make a difference, it needs to involve the exchange of money, I am willing to participate.
Steve - Hang in there!
Matrix - Hang in there with him!
[&o]
Here here,
I agree with my 100%
if you want my bucks for a pre order I'll be next in the que.
Agreed by me too. You have my support ! [&o]
You know: it is very ironic that I have been thinking exactly the same thing for some time now. But, for some reason, just never bothered to mention the pre-order thing.
I think we need to get something straight here. This is very unique in almost every way. It goes way above and beyond the typical computer game. This is an event. There is a special and unique crowd for this game. Almost everyone here knows of WiF. It is in every sense of the word, a fraternity.
With that being said, the mindset here is also completely different and unique to this game alone. I think I can speak for just about everyone involved here that is going to buy this game: Samuraiprogrammer is right square on the money with his organized thought process in his post.
There seems to be a common thene these days in the General discussion forums about how the risng cost of gas and electricity is putting the sqeeze on our gaming dollar. And people now are taking a completely new approach on how we have to now pick our battles so to speak.
This upcoming game is a different catagory all together. The price for this game no matter what the economy is a total non issue because of the uniqueness of the not only the dame itself but the clientelle involved.
Steve, you do this the right way, and there will be no end to the infinite possibilities for you.
Already people are singing your praises for the non stop work and dedication to a project such as this. This is why everyone seems to be thinking the same thing, and all along the way I have been thinking the same for the entire year. I think you should seriously consider what we are all saying here. We believe in you and your team and want to prove that by prepaying like what seems to be the general consensus here. Only in a game of this magnitude would you get special requests like this. WiF simply put is one of the most ingenous games of all time. To have the ability and the reality of putting it into computer form is something I thought completely out of the question. But here we are. All of us Wiffers waiting oh so patiently because we all know what is at stake here and we all understand how important this project is for all concerned. Just as samaurai said. Hang in there. We totally have your back on this. I hope this helps you when you you feel you have to be pressured about whether it has to be out in December or not. For all of us wiffers. Christmas happens when MWiF is released, not in December. If it happens to be in December, then great, if not, I think you have everyone's support in this manner to make sure it is done right the first time. Thanks for everything Steve. You have no idea how much we appreciate what you are doing.
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 6:52 am
by Rodwell
Perhaps NetPlay should be cut from release and pushed back to a patch?
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 2:51 pm
by Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: Rodwell
Perhaps NetPlay should be cut from release and pushed back to a patch?
Not a serious consideration. Too many want to play with friends they use to play with, but whose roads have lead them far apart.
---
I really like the rose.
---
I thank everyone for their support.[&o] Perhaps it should be said that the pressure to finish MWIF is entirely self-generated, to meet everyone's expectations. Matrix Games has applied zero pressure, leaving the decision of when to release MWIF entirely up to me.
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 8:05 pm
by marklv
Certainly, having wasted money on two hugely [:@] imperfect WW2 strategy games (Commander Europe at War and World War 2 - Road to Victory), I really need this game to deliver. I will wait however long it takes.
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 8:28 pm
by DavidFaust
The amount of changes ADG do with WiF Steve would hav a fulltime job.
I love the idea of preordering and income along the way has to be a advantage.
RE: When?
Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:37 pm
by macgregor
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: Rodwell
Perhaps NetPlay should be cut from release and pushed back to a patch?
Not a serious consideration. Too many want to play with friends they use to play with, but whose roads have lead them far apart.
---
I really like the rose.
---
I thank everyone for their support.[&o] Perhaps it should be said that the pressure to finish MWIF is entirely self-generated, to meet everyone's expectations. Matrix Games has applied zero pressure, leaving the decision of when to release MWIF entirely up to me.
Do what you must, but to me 'netplay'
is WiF. Anything pbem will be a new experience entirely, with some decisions being handled by AI.I believe you're doing everything you can. You're posting the progress regularly. What more could I ask? It sounds like you're not far off from December. Good luck with the bugs!
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:14 am
by undercovergeek
i also champion the pre pay idea, and i think you are undertaking a noble cause, however, im sticking my neck out as the first one to ask, do you know the extent of the delay and have a back up release date? This is by no means a 'whens it out call' its just so i can nudge the mrs in the ribs to get me a different christmas prezzie.......... very much looking forward to this game and ive never played the board game, simply the scope and the subject have brought me here........ good luck
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 11:07 am
by micheljq
ORIGINAL: HansHafen
I am willing to pre purchase if financial concerns are going to substantially impact the game in a negative manner. I don't know what the suggested price is, but I imagine its $100 or more.
Keep up the great work. This is my favorite game.
This game definately needs a release party at the end so everyone can meet each other and have a drink.
I thought It would be more like 90$..
About the bug with Vista, personally I use Windows XP 32 bits and I do not plan on installing that Vista crap. By the way Microsoft is developping Windows Seven as we speak suppposed to be available in 2010, just for information.
I never buy preorder.
Please don't rush the project, take the time you must. I am sure this bug and all the others will be resolved.
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 6:38 pm
by Sewerlobster
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
Thanks, but about that party, ...
Me - Honolulu
Patrice - Marseilles
Rob Armstrong - Australia
David Heath - Colorado
Erik Rutkins - Vermont
Dan Hatchen - Saskatchewan
Lars & Terje - Norway
Michael Andersen - Denmark
Andy - Idaho
Jesper - Belgium?
Wosung - Germany
... I apologize to dozens of others I did not mention here.
Using the least scientific formulae I could find, combined with my mathematics minor, I have triangulated Rio de Janeiro as the location requiring the least amount of travel yet smallest deviation of total miles (kilometers) traveled. I dares ya to disagree.[8D]
I also, as I have said in other posts, would be willing to pre-order; should Matrix Games revise its policy on the matter. I'm not sure how advance money would be a bad business model but maybe they could try it for this game.
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:27 pm
by panzers
ORIGINAL: SewerStarFish
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
Thanks, but about that party, ...
Me - Honolulu
Patrice - Marseilles
Rob Armstrong - Australia
David Heath - Colorado
Erik Rutkins - Vermont
Dan Hatchen - Saskatchewan
Lars & Terje - Norway
Michael Andersen - Denmark
Andy - Idaho
Jesper - Belgium?
Wosung - Germany
... I apologize to dozens of others I did not mention here.
Using the least scientific formulae I could find, combined with my mathematics minor, I have triangulated Rio de Janeiro as the location requiring the least amount of travel yet smallest deviation of total miles (kilometers) traveled. I dares ya to disagree.[8D]
I also, as I have said in other posts, would be willing to pre-order; should Matrix Games revise its policy on the matter. I'm not sure how advance money would be a bad business model but maybe they could try it for this game.
Novi Michigan to Rio De Janeiro Brazil: 5,196 miles, 8360 Kilometers. as the crow flies. By land: about 9000 miles. Don't count me in for your party. I'm better off going to the nice sandy beaches of Hawaii where Steve is. It's closer.
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:58 pm
by paulderynck
I'm very happy with the "don't release it until it's right " philosophy. But if something had to go to make the job easier, I'd suggest the AI.
I have yet to see a game with a good AI and there aren't any games that I know of that are as complicated as this one, so the task of making a good AI could be unending. When that knowledge sits alongside the observations made about the need for Netplay, it seems to me players should place their efforts into establishing communities of opponents, rather than playing against the computer.
RE: When?
Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 8:05 pm
by jesperpehrson
Belgium? [&:] I would not mind living in Belgium with all the nice beer they have there but I am really from Sweden.
RE: When?
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:36 am
by Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: capitan
Belgium? [&:] I would not mind living in Belgium with all the nice beer they have there but I am really from Sweden.
Wrong again! My life story. You had said something about Luxembourglast year and I made a bad assumption you lived nearby.
RE: When?
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:40 am
by Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: SewerStarFish
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
Thanks, but about that party, ...
Me - Honolulu
Patrice - Marseilles
Rob Armstrong - Australia
David Heath - Colorado
Erik Rutkins - Vermont
Dan Hatchen - Saskatchewan
Lars [San diego]
Terje - Norway
Michael Andersen - Denmark
Andy - Idaho
Jesper - [Sweden]
Wosung - Germany
... I apologize to dozens of others I did not mention here.
Using the least scientific formulae I could find, combined with my mathematics minor, I have triangulated Rio de Janeiro as the location requiring the least amount of travel yet smallest deviation of total miles (kilometers) traveled. I dares ya to disagree.[8D]
I also, as I have said in other posts, would be willing to pre-order; should Matrix Games revise its policy on the matter. I'm not sure how advance money would be a bad business model but maybe they could try it for this game.
Since you bring up the topic of global travel ...
I had some students from Botswana when I was teaching in Honolulu. Now Botswana is precisely on the other side of the world from Honolulu, so when they flew home, they could stop in any city on the planet and it wouldn't be out of their way.
RE: When?
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:14 am
by jesperpehrson
ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
You had said something about Luxembourg last year
Was it my remark that if you invade Luxemburg Sweden will declare war on Hawaii? [:D]
RE: When?
Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 9:26 am
by werwolf
I was just saying..................when?