Page 316 of 319
RE: May 1945
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:05 pm
by Canoerebel
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
Being unfamiliar with the RA mod of this game, what sorts of benefits were imparted to Allied OOB, if any?
I don't recall any additional military ships except that some AOs could be converted to CVEs. I didn't convert any (I think).
RE: May 1945
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 7:08 pm
by Canoerebel
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
Allied CA losses.
Because of your H/K CL/DD groups deployment (per your previous post), were your CL losses as marked as were your DD losses?
I lost 27 CLs, of these nationalities:
NZ: 1
Dutch: 4
Australian: 2
RN: 10
USN: 10
RE: May 1945
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:42 pm
by DOCUP
John 3rd: Great game and AAR Thanks for it all.
RE: May 1945
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:00 pm
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
Being unfamiliar with the RA mod of this game, what sorts of benefits were imparted to Allied OOB, if any?
I don't recall any additional military ships except that some AOs could be converted to CVEs. I didn't convert any (I think).
Increased fighters? Anything unusual about the land forces available? I simply don't know.
RE: May 1945
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2018 9:06 pm
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
Allied CA losses.
Because of your H/K CL/DD groups deployment (per your previous post), were your CL losses as marked as were your DD losses?
I lost 27 CLs, of these nationalities:
NZ: 1
Dutch: 4
Australian: 2
RN: 10
USN: 10
IRL, the US lost 7 CAs and 3 CLs. Were the heavier CL losses also mostly related to the Sumatra campaign?
RE: May 1945
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:59 am
by Canoerebel
I think CL losses were spread out throughout the war.
RE: May 1945
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:01 am
by Chickenboy
John,
Can you summarize the OOB benefits to the Allied OOB with your mod for us? This game started many moons ago and I don't recall.
RE: May 1945
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:02 am
by Canoerebel
I don't know much about changes to Allied air and ground OOB. John might know.
My memory is that the Allies did get a few more fighter squadrons (Hurricanes?) and a couple of Banshee dive bomber squadrons. (The Banshees didn't have an upgrade path and thus ended the war as Banshees posted in Oz.)
I think there may have been a few additional ground units (base forces?) posted somewhere like Darwin or aboard ships near Darwin. Nothing major but a few things to work with.
But I'm fuzzy on these things now and was then.
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
Being unfamiliar with the RA mod of this game, what sorts of benefits were imparted to Allied OOB, if any?
I don't recall any additional military ships except that some AOs could be converted to CVEs. I didn't convert any (I think).
Increased fighters? Anything unusual about the land forces available? I simply don't know.
RE: May 1945
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:23 am
by ny59giants
John,
Can you summarize the OOB benefits to the Allied OOB with your mod for us? This game started many moons ago and I don't recall.
I cannot speak for John, but this version of RA has gone through multiple revisions since this game started. I've probably been the major contributor to changes for the Allied OOB. Most of the changes for the Allies have gone into BTS and BTSL mods. Don't recall what we did for RA. Sorry. [:(]
RE: May 1945
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:38 am
by Chickenboy
From Page 1 of this AAR:
The Allies see continued major changes in their starting locations, new air units, several ground units, a CLAA conversion for the Omaha-CL, a pair of additional CVLs, and options for nearly 10 CVEs. The added warships reflect a ‘stopgap’ counter to the increased Japanese strength found at war’s start.
From Page 3:
Allies
1. CV Lexington is NE of Pago Pago and has a reinforced screen with CA Minneapolis and a few more DDs.
2. Allied Reinforcement TFs sit at Pago Pago and Townsville unloading and/or preparing to more. Each TF has a Cruiser--DD Escort protecting it.
3. The Pensacola Convoy starts at Darwin and is unloaded. It carries three full Squadrons of A-24 and a P-40E Squadron. The pilots are terrible but those A-24s are DANGEROUS! The Base Forces and Artillery units in the TF are unloaded with the Planes at start. Pensacola and her escorts adds a bit more to the Allied position as well.
4. The Philippines begin the war slightly more prepared (but not much).
5. A squadron of Hurricanes start at Singapore.
6. Several CD and small Base Forces are added to Pt Blair, Cocos, Pt. Moresby, and other places.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:40 am
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: SuluSea
Good luck John!
Oh no!
John, will your torpedo-equipped A6M aircraft all launch their torpedoes at a 15 degree angle off of true?
Will they drop torpedoes whilest overflying your BBs?
Shouldn't you want them to attack in closer proximity to the enemy?
Will your airgroups have such poor formation management that they appear to prepare set to slam into the forecastle of your BBs?
Will your aircraft stand much chance of making it to the enemy whilest belching smoke from 'friendly fire' battle damage?
I'll be keeping watch for these and other scintillating questions. [8D]
From page 1. Just so you can see I tried early and often to talk sense into John to not believe the propaganda. [;)]
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:48 am
by HansBolter
I think its a mistake to make comparisons between the war and the game with regard to losses incurred as the game allows for a much greater pace of operations than was the case historically.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:48 am
by Chickenboy
This was from page 5 or thereabouts:
Hey Sir!
You are correct. Japan starts off with—essentially—no additional CVs. They do get an additional CVL (18 F and 12 TB) and nothing else. Only other additional (non-historic to the OOB) ships the Fleet gets at start are 2 CL and 4 DD. NOTHING ELSE!
The biggest changes you see are deployment changes. KB (6CV) normal but Mini-KB starts at Babeldoap with all three CVLs together.
Does that help?
John
Sent: Friday, December 07, 2012 8:56 AM
Subject: Re: 12-13
John,
I began the game "blind" as to what extra goodies Japan gets in the game. I did that on purpose to avoid some of the "godlike foreknowledge" we get as we start a new game. Now that I've gotten repeated sightings on your carriers, I've decided to open the game to see what carriers you get at or near the start of the war. So I opened the game on the Japanese side and didn't find anything other than the usual lineup. Is that right? Or do you indeed get additional carriers? If so, where are they hiding? I'll look it up (or you can just email the list if it isn't long and too much trouble).
I'm essentially finished with the turn, but I do want to review Japan's carrier lineup before I send it to you.
Thanks,
Dan
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:52 am
by Canoerebel
I don't remember what additional forces Japan began the game with, nor what air or ground changes there were later in the game. I was familiar with the beefed up IJN OOB, especially carriers, CB and CA.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:26 am
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
I don't remember what additional forces Japan began the game with, nor what air or ground changes there were later in the game. I was familiar with the beefed up IJN OOB, especially carriers, CB and CA.
Without parsing through the AAR's 210+ pages, the initial OOB didn't sound like it had much more in terms of Japanese CVs. Those must have been accelerated in 1942-1943. What is your impression about the availability of Japanese CB and CAs? Available at the initiation of hostilities or 'accelerated' later?
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 11:32 am
by Canoerebel
I don't think much of the naval OOB was available at start. The additional CVs, CB, CA came in later. I don't know about DDs - how many and how early they were available, but I think there were additional hulls.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:04 pm
by Canoerebel
The following is taken from John's second post in this AAR. It gives both Allied and Japanese additions to the OOB.
In so choosing to do this Yamamoto then changes the 4th Circle Building plan replacing the 3rd and 4th Yamato-Class Battleships with three improved Shokaku-Class CVs and a pair of Kawachi-Class fast Battlecruisers, two Tone-Class CAs, an accelerated Agano-Class deployment, and additional destroyers. Quick, reasonably cheap carrier conversions are moved forward seeing all of the pre-war CVs/CVLs deploy by December 7th or at slightly earlier dates in 1942.
The Japan Naval Air Arm is changed so that everything is staked to the Zero Airframe with a specialization of the Zero into a Land-Based Interceptor as well as CV-Based Fighters. Research and production expansion is achieved by streamlining the air industry (cutting several models) while bringing forward second generation aircraft: Judy, Jill, etc… By great effort the IJNAF deploys nearly all new aircraft on December 7th.
RA 5.0 now brings his ‘vision’ to the IJN’s Land Component. He reorganizes the SNLF units into a Brigade-Sized offensive force and—knowing it will be a war of attrition—converts many Naval Guard into enhanced units with Coastal Defense artillery for a stronger defensive unit. Additional small units are added to the IJN’s Troops and support units better reflecting Yamamoto's foresight into base building, defense, and expansion needs.
The foresight of the Admiral paysoff during 1942 and early-1943 as new ships, aircraft, and ground units enter into the Japanese Order-of-Battle, however, the cost is steep. Though expanded and using modern aircraft many Japanese Naval Air units start with their experience lowered to reflect the dilution of the experienced pilots into new units. Supply and fuel reserves start at a much reduced state. The Japanese MUST take the DEI as fast as possible.
In a major change over the previous versions of Reluctant Admiral, the 3.0 postulates more of Yamamoto’s influence upon the wartime Kaigun. First class destroyers are accelerated and emphasis is shifted to the AA Akizuki-Class at the expense of the more balanced Yugumo’s. Manpower is at a premium within the Fleet so Submarines, Escorts, and ASW forces all see a major retooling reflecting the Japanese quality over quantity belief. Yamamoto chooses the immediately useful projects, including 2nd-class destroyers, fast transports and coastal defense fleet, at the expense of large destroyers and subs offered by the stock, historical choice.
It should be noted that not all the changes are for the Japanese. The Allies see continued major changes in their starting locations, new air units, several ground units, a CLAA conversion for the Omaha-CL, a pair of additional CVLs, and options for nearly 10 CVEs. The added warships reflect a ‘stopgap’ counter to the increased Japanese strength found at war’s start.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:20 pm
by Chickenboy
NYGiants,
Can you speak to the diminished supply and fuel levels cited for the IJ player versus stock? Pilot quality? Number of larger DDs / Submarines unbuilt per Yamamoto's vision? If not for RA 5.0, then for current iterations?
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:08 am
by Capt. Harlock
The Japan Naval Air Arm is changed so that everything is staked to the Zero Airframe with a specialization of the Zero into a Land-Based Interceptor as well as CV-Based Fighters. Research and production expansion is achieved by streamlining the air industry (cutting several models) while bringing forward second generation aircraft: Judy, Jill, etc… By great effort the IJNAF deploys nearly all new aircraft on December 7th.
RA 5.0 now brings his ‘vision’ to the IJN’s Land Component. He reorganizes the SNLF units into a Brigade-Sized offensive force and—knowing it will be a war of attrition—converts many Naval Guard into enhanced units with Coastal Defense artillery for a stronger defensive unit. Additional small units are added to the IJN’s Troops and support units better reflecting Yamamoto's foresight into base building, defense, and expansion needs.
The foresight of the Admiral paysoff during 1942 and early-1943 as new ships, aircraft, and ground units enter into the Japanese Order-of-Battle, however, the cost is steep. Though expanded and using modern aircraft many Japanese Naval Air units start with their experience lowered to reflect the dilution of the experienced pilots into new units.
For whatever my opinion is worth, the additional airpower is the biggest benefit to the Japanese in this mod. The Sumatra Campaign was decided because the Japanese were actually able to win an air war of attrition. U.S. industry had not yet surpassed Japanese airframe production.
RE: Islands of Destiny: RA 5.0 Japanese Side
Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:20 am
by Chickenboy
ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock
The Japan Naval Air Arm is changed so that everything is staked to the Zero Airframe with a specialization of the Zero into a Land-Based Interceptor as well as CV-Based Fighters. Research and production expansion is achieved by streamlining the air industry (cutting several models) while bringing forward second generation aircraft: Judy, Jill, etc… By great effort the IJNAF deploys nearly all new aircraft on December 7th.
RA 5.0 now brings his ‘vision’ to the IJN’s Land Component. He reorganizes the SNLF units into a Brigade-Sized offensive force and—knowing it will be a war of attrition—converts many Naval Guard into enhanced units with Coastal Defense artillery for a stronger defensive unit. Additional small units are added to the IJN’s Troops and support units better reflecting Yamamoto's foresight into base building, defense, and expansion needs.
The foresight of the Admiral paysoff during 1942 and early-1943 as new ships, aircraft, and ground units enter into the Japanese Order-of-Battle, however, the cost is steep. Though expanded and using modern aircraft many Japanese Naval Air units start with their experience lowered to reflect the dilution of the experienced pilots into new units.
For whatever my opinion is worth, the additional airpower is the biggest benefit to the Japanese in this mod. The Sumatra Campaign was decided because the Japanese were actually able to win an air war of attrition. U.S. industry had not yet surpassed Japanese airframe production.
Even in stock, that's not going to happen until late 1943-1944, right?