Matrix Games Forums

ORIGINAL: lomyrin
These options for resolution look very good.

Will there be a choice of which resolution to be used at any given zoom level, that will be saved and will automatically be switched to, when the player changes zoom level?

With email play will that mean that each player can have his own saved zoom/resolution setup that is automatic unless manually overridden?

Lars 

Yes. My intent is to let the player set a default for which unit resoultion is used with which zoom level - but he will be able to override the default whenever he pleases. I will probably store his personal choice for the default as part of a screen layout file, but I want to see how the beta testers feel about the screen layouts first. Since screen layouts are just out of the newborn stage, they might need other adjustments.

I like the medium resolution ones. A few small comments:
a) I notice on zoom level three, that the engineer E is not showing, the Marine and GAR have the vertical stripe missing. Maybe thoose lines could be made thicker in the medium resolution to enable the scaling better

b) I think that the plane and ship graphic could be made a little bit smaller and by that not cover so much of the numbers.

c) I dont think it is neessary to have the plane and ship graphics in a different colour for canadian & south african units.

So, let's look at zoom level 2, using medium resolution unit depictions.
Not so good. Which means I have to create a low res version: no silhouettes, larger font sizes, text(?!).

I think this one is OK.
When you're at level 2, you're not looking at individual counters, so it's not a problem if you don't see them really well.

A few comments :

- About the colors of the generic silhouettes, we are used to have the CVs being white as well as the ATRs and the rest being black. The only red silhouettes we have are those printed on black background.

- Also, on the low res counters, the ATR's range should stay white.

- Maybe the silhouettes should be made a little smaller as c92nichj said.

- I also like it that you will propose to replace the silhouette by the text (BB, CA, etc...)

Personaly, I like high res counters up to level 4, and generic ones from level 3.

Shouldn't the FROG Minisub be French? Ho Ho Ho. My sides!

Seriously though, looking good. Are you going to leave the CR.42bis as is, given that the black sections of it's paintjob get lost in the background? My suggestion was for a pale grey line to "connect" the aircraft. Perhaps you tried it and it looked naff?

Cheers, Neilster

Very nice looking images indeed. I agree with the comments made so far.
Make the silhouettes smaller so they're not so much covered by the numbers.
Consider using the text BB, CV, DD, LND, FTR etc. for the lowest resolutions instead
of silhouettes.

I think the silhouettes for the tactical and strategical bombers maybe could be altered
a little. Now they look like a reverse version of the ATR units. The wings in the silhouettes seem like delta wings and don't give the image of large 4 engine strategic bombers.
I attach a silhouette in a game I made for ADC2 a long time ago just to give you
a hint of what I'm taking about. I guess the silhouette I show can be improved a lot,
but I feel this looks more like a strategic bomber than the current silhouette i MWIF. [;)]

Good idea from Borger Borgersen :

I think the silhouettes for the tactical and strategical bombers maybe could be altered
a little. Now they look like a reverse version of the ATR units. The wings in the silhouettes seem like delta wings and don't give the image of large 4 engine strategic bombers.
I attach a silhouette in a game I made for ADC2 a long time ago just to give you
a hint of what I'm taking about. I guess the silhouette I show can be improved a lot,
but I feel this looks more like a strategic bomber than the current silhouette i MWIF.

Also, for the 2BP cost LND bombers, maybe show the silhouette of a Stuka.
Having 3 silhouettes for the land bombers seems right.

Here is how silhouettes looked in WiF 5th Edition. The tactical bomber was a Stuka.

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Good idea from Borger Borgersen :

I think the silhouettes for the tactical and strategical bombers maybe could be altered
a little. Now they look like a reverse version of the ATR units. The wings in the silhouettes seem like delta wings and don't give the image of large 4 engine strategic bombers.
I attach a silhouette in a game I made for ADC2 a long time ago just to give you
a hint of what I'm taking about. I guess the silhouette I show can be improved a lot,
but I feel this looks more like a strategic bomber than the current silhouette i MWIF.

Also, for the 2BP cost LND bombers, maybe show the silhouette of a Stuka.
Having 3 silhouettes for the land bombers seems right.

Here is how silhouettes looked in WiF 5th Edition. The tactical bomber was a Stuka.

I like those pictures(maybe because I played WiF5 for many years) and they would work very well in medium resolution (maybe slightly smaller).

I also like Patrices comment on keeping CV silhouttes white and other ship black.

A few comments on the preceeding posts.

- I did not color the ATRs and CVs white because I was worried about minor countries like Denmark and Yugoslavia. However, I now realize that no minor country has CVs or ATRs, so I'll change the silhouette color to white for those unit types.

- Making the silhouettes smaller seemed right to me as soon as I saw them, but I thought I would give a try at using them in the size Rob sent to me. A 20% reduction should be enough.

- If we have different silhouettes for L2 and L4, what do the L3 unit types use?

- For replacing the silhouettes with text I had stated I would use LND/FTR/NAV/ATR, would you prefer L2, L3, L4, F2, F3, N2, N3, N4, A3, and A4?

- For ASW escorts and ASW carriers I was just going to use ASW and let the numbers communicate whether it was a carrier (square color indicates carrier) or not.

- The problem of black camouflage against a black background only occurs for the 2 Belgian planes so I am going to ignore it.

- I am going to leave the Canadian colors as yellow and so on for the rest of the CW member nations. The example I gave makes them look like they are everywhere but in reality 90+% of the CW bitmapped units belong to the United Kingdom and will be colored black. The color adds a little flavor and some additional information.

- I do not expect to rework these right away. I want Rob and myself to do the color theme et al for the interface next. I also want to work with the interface for naval movement and combat to see if I can jazz that up. With both of those elements of the interface in place, I'll have a better understanding of how the medium resolution units will appear in actual use. You see, I expect the medium resolution to be the workhorse for naval movement and combat becasue you will want to have more of the map visible - which requires zoom level 1, 2, or 3.

- I am not going to do anything on the low resolution units until the medium res are finished. This is the same philosophy I used for the high/medium and I think it worked well (no wasted effort). There almost certainly will be a low res created expressly for zoom level 2. Zoom level 1 is hopeless for communicating much of anything.

- If we have different silhouettes for L2 and L4, what do the L3 unit types use?

L2 as they are also more focussed on Tactical use than the L4 which are for strategic use

- For replacing the silhouettes with text I had stated I would use LND/FTR/NAV/ATR, would you prefer L2, L3, L4, F2, F3, N2, N3, N4, A3, and A4?

I prefer LND/FTR/NAV/ATR, but I expect that I will use the bitmaps

- I am going to leave the Canadian colors as yellow and so on for the rest of the CW member nations. The example I gave makes them look like they are everywhere but in reality 90+% of the CW bitmapped units belong to the United Kingdom and will be colored black. The color adds a little flavor and some additional information.

I agree on flavour but I cannot really see what extra information it provides, the only difference between a canadian and a British Fighter is where it is reinforced

You see, I expect the medium resolution to be the workhorse for naval movement and combat becasue you will want to have more of the map visible - which requires zoom level 1, 2, or 3.

The flyout unit display feature might be a very good thing to use in the seaareas.

- I am not going to do anything on the low resolution units until the medium res are finished. This is the same philosophy I used for the high/medium and I think it worked well (no wasted effort). There almost certainly will be a low res created expressly for zoom level 2. Zoom level 1 is hopeless for communicating much of anything.

Not sure you will need to make low resolution file, just work a little bit on the bitmaps for the landunits (making the icons a little bit thicker for scaling well on level 3)

- If we have different silhouettes for L2 and L4, what do the L3 unit types use?

Any famous twin-engined bomber will do.
The most produced US twin-engined bomber is the A-20, so why not a A-20 silhouette.

http://www.aviationtrivia.homestead.com/The_Mosts.html

- I am going to leave the Canadian colors as yellow and so on for the rest of the CW member nations. The example I gave makes them look like they are everywhere but in reality 90+% of the CW bitmapped units belong to the United Kingdom and will be colored black. The color adds a little flavor and some additional information.

I like it. In some way it helps convey how different the rest of the Commonwealth was/is to the UK. The different colour draws one's eye to the country of origin immediately. I might be a bit biased, coming from Australia but I like to see the global contribution of the Empire (I love using that word) highlighted.

Cheers, Neilster

My take at LND Silhouettes for Generic Graphics.

From left to right : LND2 (Ju87G Stuka), LND3 (A-20 Havoc), LND4 (B-17F Flying Fortress).

My take at FTR silhouettes for Generic Graphics.

From top to Bottom : FTR2 (Me109F), FTR3 (P-38 Lightning).

My take at NAV silhouettes for Generic Graphics.

From left to right : NAV2 (SBD Dauntless), NAV3 (G4M Betty), NAV4 (H8K Emily).

Patrice,

These are nice. They have more detail than what will be visible at zoom level 4, but I'll give them a try.

Where did the silhouettes come from. Any copy right issues on those? Or is that a stupid question since it's silhouettes?
Just asking to keep sure Steve stay alert...

ORIGINAL: ullern

Where did the silhouettes come from. Any copy right issues on those? Or is that a stupid question since it's silhouettes?
Just asking to keep sure Steve stay alert...

I made them tonight.
I took profiles that I have, and I have outlined them in black in a separate layer, and then painted them all over in black. I then took out the layer alone, and saved it as JPG after resizing it about 400 pixels wide, and pitching the NAV 30 degrees.

Nice work Patrice.

My only concern is the Stuka. When does that counter enter the force pools because you appear to have depicted a Ju 87G with BK 3.7cm cannons which didn't enter service until about mid 1943?

Cheers, Neilster

ORIGINAL: Neilster
Nice work Patrice.
My only concern is the Stuka. When does that counter enter the force pools because you appear to have depicted a Ju 87G with BK 3.7cm cannons which didn't enter service until about mid 1943?
Cheers, Neilster

Sure, but that was the silhouette used for WiF 5th Edition Tactical bombers, so I thought it showed more power that way. The entry date of the real aircraft depicted by the silhouette is not a problem, this is only a generic picture.
Anyway, if Steve wants, it is easy to cut its cannon barrels to make it look like a normal wide spread used Ju87D Stuka.

ORIGINAL: Froonp

ORIGINAL: Neilster
Nice work Patrice.
My only concern is the Stuka. When does that counter enter the force pools because you appear to have depicted a Ju 87G with BK 3.7cm cannons which didn't enter service until about mid 1943?
Cheers, Neilster

Sure, but that was the silhouette used for WiF 5th Edition Tactical bombers, so I thought it showed more power that way. The entry date of the real aircraft depicted by the silhouette is not a problem, this is only a generic picture.
Anyway, if Steve wants, it is easy to cut its cannon barrels to make it look like a normal wide spread used Ju87D Stuka.

The silhouettes will be the same for all years of the war and for all the different countries participating in same. My main desire would be for the silhouettes to be readily distinguishable by the players when playing (3 and 4 are the most likely zoom levels where medium resolution/silhouettes will be used/shown).

I'll try to get to trying out Patrice's versions this week.

--- Yesterday, the guy in the apartment directly above mine used a power saw to cut through a hot water line and flooded the apartments in the 16 floors below him. There have been workmen in and out and I now have four very large fans blowing constantly in an attempt to dry the walls and floor. Somewhat hard to think clearly.[:@]