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Disgraceful performance... 8 warships launch long lances at a mere 3,000 yards without being detected and miss 2 merchant ships!

Seriously, this and another combat where a strong SAG launched long lances against a lone mine layer point out something that might make The List to be looked at for a future patch. Long lances were expensive and great to have when you actually need them. Perhaps there should be some chance they won't be used on such unworthy targets?

So do you mean disgraceful performance shouldn't be allowed?
There are a set of opinions that seems to want to turn witp-AE in a game that planes always hit the right targets, that ships and pilots obey all orders, that recon give reliable information. War is not that. For example it was very comon the mistake of submarine commanders of wasting torpedos against targets that appeared big ships and then at close range were fisher boats.

Edit: analysing further the only question i have is if all ships fired torpedos. If that happened i think you might have a point since there were only 2 targets. Note that i am not saying it is an impossible occurence , if lookouts determine one of the targets is a BB the commander job is to send a spread of Longlances.

A good idea for a patch: in Battle info the identification that lookouts make should appear in text:

CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 3,000 yards, identified lead ship as a BB

The problem here is i don't know if that first info can be superseded by further info in same turn with current game engine.

You read too much into my question/comment. Don has already answered: firing torps is not automatic.

As you point out mis-ID'ing an AK as a BB should trigger torps launching and did.

As you point out mis-ID'ing an AK as a BB should trigger torps launching and did.

Well we don't know what happened.

Dec 12.

Penguin makes contact with the xAK transporting the 4th bn 66 nav gd to Wewak in 2 seperate hexes. Neither ship shoots either time. The force unloads.

2 Jap DDs find an allied AK at Sibuyan and dispatch her. The same 2 DDs encounter 3 PTs making a run to Cayagan just NE of the base and sink them all. Then they encounter another AK at Siquijor and sink it as well. They finally encounter Boise with 4 DDs NW of Mindanao and hit her 3 times and put heavy fires on one DD before they are overwhelmed and sunk. This battle proves to be pivotable later in the day.

PG Isabel engages Jap transports unloading at Cayagan and hits 1 3 times. She engages again later in the morning scoring 6 more hits on the same AK. And yet a 3rd time scoring 2 more hits on the same AK. Net result of these 3 engagements is 3 system and 10 flood damage to the transport.

Chokai and her DD engage Dragon and Durban off the north coast of Borneo. Jap ships were likely low on ammo because they got mauled for very minor return damage. Chokai has 56 system damage but more seriously she has 59 flood damage of which only 5 of it is major damage. This means (in simple terms that I can understand) 54% of her hull is letting water in. She will probably only last a turn or 2 at most. Her engines are almost unscathed and can still make 12 kts. She is 360 miles from Brunei and I have a fleet HQ and 3 base forces that will be there before the Chokai arrives (assuming she makes it). Will be a major effort to save her.

146th inf reg (56 div) and an air co land at Ternate. This is a level 3 port between Ambon and Menado. It will be my forward repair base in the upcoming Kendari operation. Naval HQ and base force units are headed in this direction but are still a fair distance away (coming from Formosa).

A Dutch sub torpedoes an AK loaded and heading for northwestern Borneo causing major damage.

6 Dutch PTs engage the Ambon invasion force and lose 2 (plus 1 heavily damaged) for no effect. The remaining PTs engage the Ryujo TF hitting CA Haguro with 1 torp. This hit caused NO system damage and only 3 flood damage but Im sure the allies will feel good about it. 1 of the PTs was sunk in this encounter. CL Nagara and her 7 DDs finished off the remaining 3 PTs later in the day. Kimura detachment of the 33rd inf reg (16 div), 1st Kure SNLF, 2 airfield cos and a naval construction bn land on Ambon. 2 PBs and an AK each take 1 hit from shore fire. Ryujo launches Mabels and Kates to raid the airfield and only score 4 hits on the runway.

9th inf reg, 20th inf reg, 16 recce, and 16 eng reg all of the 16th div land at Atimonan (about half way between Naga and Manila). A US DD shows up, takes 1 shell hit from covering forces and retires.

The Boise shows up at Cayagan with 3 of her DDs in tow and only manages 2 hits on the transports unloading there before they retire. The previous battle with the DDs probably exhausted all their ammo. 65th bde secures Cayagan later in the day forcing the defenders south towards Davao.

Minor air attacks in the nothern areas of Luzon achieve nothing.

51 Lillys raid Kuantan for no effect. Im guessing all operational British aircraft have left. An attack later by Nells destroys a Blenheim on the ground. Likely one that was damaged and couldnt move.

Chinese SB-IIIs attack the 9th armored car co east of Changsha damaging several vehicles.

A few minor attacks on Jap AKs north of Borneo score 1 minor hit.

Rabul Hudsons hit an empty small AK at Manus and sinks her.

Kates from the Zuiho and Hosho (escorting the Rabaul invasion force) launch 2 attacks on AK Governor Wright south of Iwo Jima and hit will 2 torps.

Seawolf is damaged by ASW forces escorting an AK south of Saigon.

Tavoy raided by 5 Anns scoring 5 hits on the airfield.

6th tank reg lands at Butan just east of Cagayan.

1st assault of Hong Kong goes in at 1:1 odds reducing the fort to level 2. 1400 Jap casualties to 930 allied.

The 12th and 18th Chinese divs along with the 1st mxd bde attack Chinese forces that moved into Sinyang and tossed them back with heavy losses at 34:1.

The 9th mxd bde manhandles a Chinese force NE of Taiyuan for 344:1 odds driving them up into the mountains.

32nd div takes Kweiteh, a dot base on the rail line half way between Suchow and Kaifeng. It has 20 light factories and 60 resources. Chinese units are swarming north and west of the city between here and Japanese controlled Kaifeng.

Manado, Guam, Hollandia, Kavieng, Namatanai, and Manus all fall to assaulting forces.

Japanese paratroops fall on Jolo capturing the undefended base.

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Chokai and her DD engage Dragon and Durban off the north coast of Borneo. Jap ships were likely low on ammo because they got mauled for very minor return damage. Chokai has 56 system damage but more seriously she has 59 flood damage of which only 5 of it is major damage. This means (in simple terms that I can understand) 54% of her hull is letting water in. She will probably only last a turn or 2 at most. Her engines are almost unscathed and can still make 12 kts. She is 360 miles from Brunei and I have a fleet HQ and 3 base forces that will be there before the Chokai arrives (assuming she makes it). Will be a major effort to save her.

Does this mean that ship speed is now separate from sys damage?

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Chokai and her DD engage Dragon and Durban off the north coast of Borneo. Jap ships were likely low on ammo because they got mauled for very minor return damage. Chokai has 56 system damage but more seriously she has 59 flood damage of which only 5 of it is major damage. This means (in simple terms that I can understand) 54% of her hull is letting water in. She will probably only last a turn or 2 at most. Her engines are almost unscathed and can still make 12 kts. She is 360 miles from Brunei and I have a fleet HQ and 3 base forces that will be there before the Chokai arrives (assuming she makes it). Will be a major effort to save her.

Does this mean that ship speed is now separate from sys damage?

Not exactly. AE has engine damage, which is far more important for speed. However other types of damage can also slow down a ship - floatation due to lost of hull form and system due to loss of support systems.

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger
Chokai and her DD engage Dragon and Durban off the north coast of Borneo. Jap ships were likely low on ammo because they got mauled for very minor return damage. Chokai has 56 system damage but more seriously she has 59 flood damage of which only 5 of it is major damage. This means (in simple terms that I can understand) 54% of her hull is letting water in. She will probably only last a turn or 2 at most. Her engines are almost unscathed and can still make 12 kts. She is 360 miles from Brunei and I have a fleet HQ and 3 base forces that will be there before the Chokai arrives (assuming she makes it). Will be a major effort to save her.

Also, just to clarify the above... 5 Major Flotation damage means that effectively 5% of the hull has a hole, leak or other problem that's causing a loss of integrity. The additional 54 points of Minor Flotation damage that brings the total to 59 is basically "Flooding". So there's a lot of water in the ship, but the hull itself is not blown in half. Minor Flotation (flooding) is much more easily "repaired". If the crew manages to use their pumps keep up with the incoming water and the flooding doesn't destroy too many systems, she could make it, but it's not a good situation when you have that much flooding and are already at 56 System Damage too. If she makes it to port though, the flooding should be fairly quickly drained and the relatively low damage to the hull itself (the 5 Major Flotation) could be patched in major ports or by AR ships or Shipyards.

Regards,

- Erik

If major floatation means the holes in the hull and minor is the water in the ship, the increase of minor floatation should depend on major floatation, shouldn't it? With only 5 major floatation I would not expect much increase of the actual flooding, thus the ship should be quite safe...

well the increase in flooding probably depends also on the existing level of flooding and the system damage, which would hinder the Damage control... If a ship has 5 major flotation but 80 minor flotation and 70 sys damage, it is deadn they will never manage to save it... If it has 5 major flotation, 50 minor flotation, but 5 sys damage and is allied, I guess it is pretty safe... in this situation with 5, 50 something and 50 something plus being japanese it doesn't look too good to me...

Pretty much as veji1 said - yes, the degree of major flotation determines the risk of additional flooding, but the stuff going on in the background is a lot more complex than that. You've got damage progression, damage control, critical events, etc. all in combination and a lot of factors are taken into account in all cases. Suffice to say that high system damage (which includes things like pumps and electrical systems) will influence the crew's ability to stabilize or decrease flooding.

The crew will prioritize flooding over everything except fire, so they will be putting the majority of their effort to keeping the ship from filling up with water and sinking. Easier said than done in some cases though and if they get a critical event of some kind working against them, together with some bad rolls on the flooding and system damage progression, it could be time to abandon ship.

Rationalizing this, a ship could sink even with a fairly small hole if it's in the wrong place, enough water gets in before DC gets a handle on things, enough systems are down due to flooding or other damage, a few doors weren't closed, bulkheads blown out by enemy fire, etc.

With the ship listed above, I think it has a decent chance if it's fairly close to a port. If it has a long trip to make, that will mean more chances of something going wrong.

Regards,

- Erik

Erik,

Do I detect some excitement on your part over AE?

ORIGINAL: witpqs
Do I detect some excitement on your part over AE?

I've been excited about AE for a looong time. [8D]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
I've been excited about AE for a looong time. [8D]

To be more precise - Erik and I first discussed the idea in August 2005 - whew - 3.5 years later here we are - a few days loooooner than we expected!
[:D]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

To be more precise - Erik and I first discussed the idea in August 2005 - whew - 3.5 years later here we are - a few days loooooner than we expected!
[:D]

I think I recall the early days of it and your "recruitment drive" so to speak. I'm glad that you were able to nail objectives down and get it this far. Just wish I could have helped, never enough time to do everything I want though.[:D]

Greetings.

Well, for us on the receiving end, the last four years have been absorbing.... from what I can see, the next four will be... engrossing...or perhaps we need a new word?

"Divorceful," maybe? [:D]

Regards,
Helldiver

ORIGINAL: Iridium
I think I recall the early days of it and your "recruitment drive" so to speak. I'm glad that you were able to nail objectives down and get it this far. Just wish I could have helped, never enough time to do everything I want though.[:D]

Yes you do - or should [:D] - since you were involved in the "UBer WITP" activity - which preceeded what we now call AE.

Holy Heck. Drop tanks...units recalled to the US...company sized garrisons..individual machine guns dropped in the water.


This is going to be over the top, obsessive, red meat for grognards. [:)]


Can't wait.

It was probably a tutorial or perhaps a game manual, but the words I read then are coming back to me now:

"As your forces approach the target, the pace of operations will accelerate dramatically"

And what do we see in the AE forum? Multiple AAR threads, a geometric increase in the amount of new information, comments such as "the final art", and even Eric making an appearance. Forget "opening the kimono" - it's been yanked off and hurled to the floor! Oh yes, the goal is indeed in sight. We are close gentlemen, very close. [:)]

We encountered a problem with our game. We are going to re-start after the next build. The problem is probably related to starting with 1 version and upgrading to another so next one we start we are sticking to and not upgrading.

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

We encountered a problem with our game. We are going to re-start after the next build. The problem is probably related to starting with 1 version and upgrading to another so next one we start we are sticking to and not upgrading.

Pitty, I really liked to read this AE AAR....