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RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 12:52 am
by TheHellPatrol
[8D]I'm doing both, download the minute it is available and have a retail copy shipped super saver shipping. I have been known to be excessive with my hobbies[;)].
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:35 am
by eMonticello
I'm delaying the game download by a day so I can whine about the slow servers. Then, of course, I'll whine about the inability to read the PDF manual on the King's Throne. While on a roll, I'll complain about not receiving a paper manual with the download and question Matrix's dedication to me ... er, their customers. After all, it doesn't make sense for Matrix and 2x3 to expect a profit if I don't receive a manual that I probably won't read anyway since I can ask silly questions in the forum.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 10:16 am
by Gen.Hoepner
Altough i can agree on a certain degree with the assumption that it's quite hard to have a good sell out in "normal shops", i can say that my own experience tells that you can grab some customers on the normal retail way.
I've known Matrix company som years ago ( was 2001 i guess). A quite-well-known game-magazine ( The games Machine ) published here in Italy a free copy of Steel Panthers WAW. I bought the magazine and played that game a bit. When i tried to know something more about the game mechanics i ended up here on these forums. I have to say that in those years the idea of buying something with my credit card on the net was not that appealing for me, so i stayed around here but did not buy anything. Then one day i was wandering in Venice with my girlfriend and passed by a little game shop. All of a sudden i saw a Box blu and red ....Uncommon Valour...i said to myself: " you've seen this title before, right?..Oh yes, the one published by Matrix! but i'm not that interested in the Pacific theatre....well, who cares, let's give them a try"
I bought that game in the shop and played for ages. Then i made up my mind and bought 3 Mega Campaigns for SPWAW not with DD but in the older way ( order only and wait for the shipment). and then everything started: I bought with DD Witp and now i'm waiting to buy GGWAW......so i can say that probably, if i hadn't seen uncommon Valour in that Shop, now i would not be a loyal matrix customer
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 1:52 pm
by Pippin
I live in LA and have tons of computer game stores in my neighborhood. Not one actually intends to stock the item. That is Best Buy, Comp USA, or EB. They will special order them but sells of war games has never been adequate for them to put them on the shelves. This game will get no more display then any war game.
There is a very small EB store down the road from me. Yet they seem to have about five MG titles on the shelves at a time.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:08 pm
by HercMighty
I Pre-Ordered from EB last night using the in-store pickup method. I have used this before and it is nice since I get the game the store get's it and I am guarnteed a copy, especially since the one by my house is a smaller one and deals more in PS2/XBOX than PC Games.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 4:21 pm
by Mr.Frag
I don't receive a manual that I probably won't read anyway since I can ask silly questions in the forum
I wonder if the inclusion of a paper manual will cut back on the forum posts at all. I suspect not! [:D]
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 5:19 pm
by Sonny
ORIGINAL: TheHellPatrol
...................................
this is what we all need to "kick it up a notch (BAM)".
.......................
Emerill would be proud of you![;)][:D]
I can hardly fit into the local EB store in the mall. It is so crowded with teens getting the latest console games. The few pc games are way in the back with about 5% of the shelf space alloted to them. A fwe pc games on the New Release rack for about a week or so then they are put in the back and forgotten.
Quite disappointing. So I seldom go there and there just are not that many pc games I am interested in. That makes digital download the way to go for me. However, if Matrix thinks it helps them then I'll do the retail bit.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 6:34 pm
by Joel Billings
ORIGINAL: Gen.Hoepner
......so i can say that probably, if i hadn't seen uncommon Valour in that Shop, now i would not be a loyal matrix customer
That's a great testimonial to why it's important every so often to make a more mainstream product and get it into the stores. It's easy to think that everyone interested has taken the time to find Matrix, but the reality (as they learned at Origins last year) is that there are thousands of people with busy lives that don't realize that an entire computer wargame industry exhists on the net.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 9:20 pm
by kfmiller41
just had to chime in on this thread. I have been a loyal MG supporter and a computer wargamer for years. I have to travel 35 miles to go to the local EB and these days I usually dont bother, as it is way to easy to order games online and have them delivered. Although I agree that matrix needs to get there product out there for people to see, the best way to actually get new players these days is to make a game for X-box or play station, sorry to say[:@] The number of computer games in the EB I go to has shrunk to less then 20% of the store. I will order online as always, but i do hope EB will get the game on its shelves in Jacksonville so poeple who never hear of these can maybe try them. I notice another sad thing with retail, most of the sales people wouldn't know a good wargame is it hit them with a bat[:D] If its not a FPS or action game the sales guys dont play it. So asking them if is any good is, well a waste of time. For me that doesnt matter, but for a new player who doesnt know what it is, that hurts. JUst my 2 cents
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 12:16 am
by SeaMonkey
Name me one instance when pessimism got something done, quicker, cheaper, better than the optimistic perspective. Anyone ever remember their Mom telling them the story about "The Little Train that Could"?
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 1:18 am
by Kung Karl
GO Matrix!!!
You give me the time of my life!
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:20 am
by Marc gto
the only thing i dont like about the digital download is lack of a manual plus the fact if you dont have a burner you could lose the game
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 3:33 am
by Sonny
ORIGINAL: SeaMonkey
.......... Anyone ever remember their Mom telling them the story about "The Little Train that Could"?
Yes, and Goldilocks and Hansel & Gretel and Three Little Pigs and the Easter Bunny and ...
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 8:33 pm
by pompack
Wisdom of the Ages:
"Always listen to experts. If an expert tells you that something can be done, he is usually right. If an expert tells you something can't be done, try it anyway; to date no expert has predicted a fundamental breakthrough. So why listen to experts? It makes them happy and happiness is always in short supply"
P.S. Consistency in spelling is the sign of a fettered mind
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Sun Mar 06, 2005 8:59 pm
by SeaMonkey
Glad to see there was no oversight in your upbringing.[;)]
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:20 am
by Grifman
Thanks but I don't want to wait for two weeks after the release for them to finally get me a copy I will stick with the proven downloads.
Targul
Well, if you go and pre-order it, they will have it in the store on the first day, no wait involved at all. So go into the store , order now, and help Matrix out. You really have no excuse
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 2:31 am
by Sonny
ORIGINAL: Grifman
Thanks but I don't want to wait for two weeks after the release for them to finally get me a copy I will stick with the proven downloads.
Targul
But if it is like the EB at my local mall they won't have it the first day it is released. In fact since it isnt a FPS they will not have heard of it until you ask and they look it up in their computer. Then they will tell you it will be in "tomorrow". Tomorrow comes and it won't be there. You say "you guys told me it would be in today" and the (different) guy behind the counter will tell you that the guy you talked to yesterday is new and he did not know how to read the listing in the computer - but it will definitely be in tomorrow (Friday) or the next day (Monday).
Well, if you go and pre-order it, they will have it in the store on the first day, no wait involved at all. So go into the store , order now, and help Matrix out. You really have no excuse
[8|]
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 2:41 am
by SlapBone
ORIGINAL: Grifman
Thanks but I don't want to wait for two weeks after the release for them to finally get me a copy I will stick with the proven downloads.
Targul
Well, if you go and pre-order it, they will have it in the store on the first day, no wait involved at all. So go into the store , order now, and help Matrix out. You really have no excuse
Preordering is one of the many scams that the retail arm of this industry uses to control the other parts (i.e... publishers, developers). I live in a metropolitan area where it will be rather easy to get out of my house and buy a copy of this game from a retail outlet, where they will probably be plentiful, but it will not be nearly as easy as downloading from Matrix directly.
I am not quite so nihilistic as everyone else in thinking that if Matrix sinks that the wargame industry will die. Hey if my 40 bucks (over the internet) isn't enough and Matrix somehow goes broke because I didn't "support them in retail" then I say "so what". As long as there is a demand, there will be a supply.
Let me set the record straight with that thought:
I own every game that Matrix has released (except Campaigns on the Danube).
The only game I paid less than full price on was Titans of Steel (and got called a thief by Paul Vebber for my troubles).
When GGWaW is realeased i will, once again, pony up with $40 and support the developers of an excellent game. They will reciprocate by giving me a license of the game. This is supply and demand.
I will not take part of any preordering scams. I will not buy "opened" software at a retail outlet (they all do this now). I will not give in to any fear tactics from Matrix about how this "industry is dying and we need to do good at retail".
We now return to your regularly scheduled programming.
P.S. I just want to say again how much I enjoy the games from Matrix.
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 1:04 pm
by dbt1949_slith
I live in NW Arkansas and the nearest game stores are 35 miles away .I think it's been two years since the last time I bought at aB&M type store. I buy all my games online.So I'll get this one online too,altho it seems kind of .............weird(not going with the digital download from Matrix).
RE: Digital Download before Store Release
Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 1:33 pm
by Scott_WAR
ORIGINAL: Paul Vebber
HOw manytimes does it need to be said that the retail distribution of GGWaW is a SPECIAL CASE for what we hope is a "cross-over" product that will hopefully attract people to wargaming titles that otherwise wouldn't come here to our site.
ONE GAME out of half dozen recently released, or coming soon is hardly "trying to FOCUS on the "mainstream" gamer!
We have pretty much abaondoned the "heavy retail" market for our "hardcore" wargame titles becasue for those games, it didn't work well.
We have no intention of going BACK to that "focus" so you should feel confident no "warnigns" are needed. We been there, done that, didn't even get a T-shirt...
we started with direct by mail distribution. We did OK and decided to test teh retail waters. We did pretty good, but there were some major limitations with, despite attempts to limit it, our games winding up int eh bargain bin where we get nothing and us trying to sell for "full price" direct. You ge an initial surge of sales, but over time its overall return is questionable. THAT is wy we have abandoned the retail chaoons for digital downloads and hobby speciality shops (where the chances of large numbers of "bargain bin" ringers soaking off 'paying sales' is much lower.
That said, there are some titles that we think have a chance to be a success in the rtail market, and at teh least keep at least a PRESENCE in the retail chains for a few Matrix products to try to attract more to the "harder core" titles.
You suggest that this turn to retail is a "turn down the "wrong road". You seem to not have been around for our excursion DOWN THAT VERY ROAD with mixed results. WHy would we suddenly go BACK to what we already dabbled in and found wanting?
We understand the concern, but want to make sure those of you new to us, that we have been through a lot of trials and tribulations in the last 5 years bootsrapping ourselves from giving away free mods of other peoples games, to offering more wargames - from more eras and a greate complexity range than any other publisher out there!
WE appreciated advice, but we are not as new o this as it might seem, and what we have found is that a "mixed strategy" in game theory terms is required to maximize ease of sale, customer satisfaction, and return on investment - a strategy that heavily emphasizes online sales - both digital downloads and physical boxes. Works with small specialty shops - in particular overseas, AND for potential crossover products (and THEM ONLY) a broader retail penetration.
Thanks for your concern! But hang around and I think you will see we have a pretty good plan, and best of all we keep tweaking it as we go to ensure it stays on top of things!
Followed by this later
ORIGINAL: Paul Vebber
Doing well at retail will mean considerable exposure outside our tradional niche. That is crucial to the growth required for us and our developers to enjoy long term success. Also it ensures we have leverage to use the retail channel when we feel it appropriate. If a retail offereing does well at retail, we retain the option in the future. If it flops at retail, we have a much more difficult time attempting such in the future - teh chances fo expanding the niche go way down.
So, anyone else see the contradiction? You cant say you dont plan to enter the retail market, having learned the hard way in the past it isnt your market, then turn around and say that that exact thing is necessary for growth and expansion.
Statement one says this is a special case, and that Matrix has learned from the past that retail is not the way to go.
Statement 2 says that retail is necessary for Matrix's growth.
So which is it? You dont have plans for moving into retail, or its necessary to move into retail? I dont think it works both ways.