Matrix Games Forums

I don't know if I didn't do something right, but it doesn't look like there was an equipment update to the game database. Am I missing something? If not then it's a fairly disappointing oversight, I have the original CoW and I expected at least some updates. True, Girzzleys and LAV's can be used for Strykers but what about the F-35, J-10, Eurofighter, PAC-3, and even longer term systems like FCS and FRES (hypothetical versions of course). At least you didn't need these in the original to wargame a current war (though they would have nice even then), but that is no longer the case. It isn't even possible to accurately do something like Lebanon 06 since there aren't any Merkava IV's and Achzarit/Puma/Nagmachon in the database. Oh, there does appear to be the T-64A added to the equipment database so I guess NATO-WP games can be that much more accurate. Is there no way to include you're own equipment? If this is the case, and I'm not just being an idiot, it's very annoying to have just paid $40 for the addition of T-64A’s to a game I bought 6 years ago (admittedly the AA works much better, though it only matters in more modern games where the old equipment is a problem anyways, and the AI is improved, but it's not worth $40).

There is an user-made equipment editor for TOAW-COW (the BioEditor). There are moves afoot to develop something similar for TOAW III.

the AA works much better, though it only matters in more modern games where the old equipment is a problem anyways

It matters in any scenario with aircraft. Trust me.

Not only are moves afoot, but (speaking as an uninformed lurker), from the TDG Forum, it looks like they are coming together. Is this true? From what I read (overheard), one of the main concern it clearing room for Ralph (who has soooo much free time [;)]) to take at look at the (alpha or beta) version of the upgraded editor to see if it can be squeezed into the TAOW3 code realistically (e.g. time and cost effictive). Do I have it approximately correct, or should I keep my day job & go back to lurking? [:D]

iarodus,

I asked the same question several months ago.

I am still waiting for a unit editor before I shell out $40 for this game.

The day that a working unit editor for TOAW-III becomes available is the day that I get my credit card out.

But until then I am still waiting...

...I am still waiting for a unit editor before I shell out $40 for this game.

The day that a working unit editor for TOAW-III becomes available is the day that I get my credit card out.

But until then I am still waiting...

Ditto

ORIGINAL: TOCarroll
Not only are moves afoot, but (speaking as an uninformed lurker), from the TDG Forum, it looks like they are coming together. Is this true? From what I read (overheard), one of the main concern it clearing room for Ralph (who has soooo much free time [;)]) to take at look at the (alpha or beta) version of the upgraded editor to see if it can be squeezed into the TAOW3 code realistically (e.g. time and cost effictive). Do I have it approximately correct, or should I keep my day job & go back to lurking? [:D]

Not exaclty correct, we're trying to do something simpler that won't involve modding executables. Right now, it looks good, and it's being tested to make sure it doesn't have any unintended consequences. Of course, I can't promise when it will be out.

Sorry Ralph, I tend to get a bit hyperbolic at times. [X(] My point is, progress is being made. Let's all hope for a piece de resistance, rather than a coup de gras [:'(]! (Just kidding folks, from the lurker's point of view, it should work, and is a clever work around a difficult problem.
 
Many thanks to Ralph and helpers for the hard work.[&o][&o][&o] 

ralphtrick,

I am grateful for your efforts. I have waited this long and I can wait a while longer.

I have confidence that the unit editor you come up with will be well worth the wait.

I'm looking forward to pulling my new credit card out of my wallet when your unit editor is released. [:)]

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick

ORIGINAL: TOCarroll
Not only are moves afoot, but (speaking as an uninformed lurker), from the TDG Forum, it looks like they are coming together. Is this true? From what I read (overheard), one of the main concern it clearing room for Ralph (who has soooo much free time [;)]) to take at look at the (alpha or beta) version of the upgraded editor to see if it can be squeezed into the TAOW3 code realistically (e.g. time and cost effictive). Do I have it approximately correct, or should I keep my day job & go back to lurking? [:D]

Not exaclty correct, we're trying to do something simpler that won't involve modding executables. Right now, it looks good, and it's being tested to make sure it doesn't have any unintended consequences. Of course, I can't promise when it will be out.

It'd be great if you went the other way and made something more ambitious that could produce more profoundly modified executables.

For example, I was thinking about how to model the ability of armies in pre-1950 times to operate in deep desert -- and the importance of holding oases and things when they do. Obviously units stuck out in the sand dunes are going to slowly expire.

The (rather short-lived) solution I hit upon was to make all the non-oasis deep desert hexes contaminated. Then units that couldn't end their turn in oases and such would degrade in terms of supply and readiness.

...too bad contaminated hexes turn out to impose a severe movement penalty. What I'd like to have is something that would let me edit that out. In fact, editable terrain in general is something that should be available. Doesn't seem like it should be too hard to provide, either. Some slots for 'user defined terrain' which lets one specify the tiles to be used and the characteristics of the terrain.

See my response about players wanting a more "elegant solution" in the TAOW3 main form. If it works, its a big step forward, and may even nudge some folks at TDG to come up with something better. [:D] Personally I think an 8 year-old game (with mods) holding down as many fans is pretty incredible in itself.

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick
we're trying to do something simpler that won't involve modding executables. Right now, it looks good, and it's being tested to make sure it doesn't have any unintended consequences. Of course, I can't promise when it will be out.

[8D][8D][8D]What's a good news!

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick
we're trying to do something simpler that won't involve modding executables.

That would be good news for a dumbo like me

ORIGINAL: TOCarroll

See my response about players wanting a more "elegant solution" in the TAOW3 main form. If it works, its a big step forward, and may even nudge some folks at TDG to come up with something better. [:D] Personally I think an 8 year-old game (with mods) holding down as many fans is pretty incredible in itself.

Well, I'm all for it -- if it permits at least what the Bioeditor currently permits. Ralph's characterization of the change as 'something simpler' doesn't exactly guarantee that.

My concerns, of course, relate to my own scenarios. Right now, I use weapons modified in various ways, altered weapon type tiles, and altered graphics titles. I'd just as soon upgrade to TOAW III and take advantage of what it offers -- but I'd want to be able to cary over changes of the types I've enumerated. To put it differently, while I'd be happy to convert Seelowe to TOAW III, the game wouldn't be worth the candle if I had to lose modified panzers and other weapons, 'polder,' 'uplands,' and seaborne supply routes, usable coastal defence guns, and indivisible companies.

Matrix is of course free to do whatever it likes. I'm merely stating what I would prefer to see. I don't particularly want to be faced with a choice between continuing to use an obsolescent system and using one that while improved in some ways, would actually represent a step backwards in others.

ORIGINAL: ColinWright

Well, I'm all for it -- if it permits at least what the Bioeditor currently permits. Ralph's characterization of the change as 'something simpler' doesn't exactly guarantee that.

I wouldn't worry.

My concerns, of course, relate to my own scenarios. Right now, I use weapons modified in various ways, altered weapon type tiles, and altered graphics titles.

TOAW III as it stands can do modified graphics- that's never been a problem. You can also change the names of various things, which I think includes terrain types, though this involves something a little elaborate.

usable coastal defence guns

Again, not a problem. Zero move units do not consume the entire turn in TOAW. So you could do away with your tortuous fix for this problem entirely.

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: ColinWright

Well, I'm all for it -- if it permits at least what the Bioeditor currently permits. Ralph's characterization of the change as 'something simpler' doesn't exactly guarantee that.

I wouldn't worry.

My concerns, of course, relate to my own scenarios. Right now, I use weapons modified in various ways, altered weapon type tiles, and altered graphics titles.

TOAW III as it stands can do modified graphics- that's never been a problem. You can also change the names of various things, which I think includes terrain types, though this involves something a little elaborate.

Mm. Well one certainly could modify any tile in any way one wanted, but then how would one get the program to use that tile? If one just replaced the original tile with it, then it would be used by all scenarios -- and no one else could play your scenario as it was intended to be played without similarly permanently altering their game.

The alternative could be to instruct players to copy all tiles and save them elsewhere before replacing the original tiles with yours and launching the scenario. This doesn't really strike me as an improvement over a modified .exe that permits one to just call up different tiles for that particular scenario.

Colin,
I've got some good news for you. I take it that you haven't heard about the per scenatio Graphics, Text, and (to a lesser extent) Sound capabilities that are already in TOAW III?

You don't need to mod the executable to run them. I'm hoping to add per scenario Equipment to that list.

When you start a scenario or turn, TOAW III looks in several known places for the modified files, and uses them instead of the original files.[8D] It should be possible to do something similar with equipment. That means that distributing the scenario will require several sub-folders, but you won't need to mod the executable any more. One downside is that both players will need to install the scenario, but I think that most people would anyway.[:)]

Ralph

ORIGINAL: ColinWright
Mm. Well one certainly could modify any tile in any way one wanted, but then how would one get the program to use that tile? If one just replaced the original tile with it, then it would be used by all scenarios -- and no one else could play your scenario as it was intended to be played without similarly permanently altering their game.

The alternative could be to instruct players to copy all tiles and save them elsewhere before replacing the original tiles with yours and launching the scenario. This doesn't really strike me as an improvement over a modified .exe that permits one to just call up different tiles for that particular scenario.

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick

Colin,
I've got some good news for you. I take it that you haven't heard about the per scenatio Graphics, Text, and (to a lesser extent) Sound capabilities that are already in TOAW III?

You don't need to mod the executable to run them. I'm hoping to add per scenario Equipment to that list.

When you start a scenario or turn, TOAW III looks in several known places for the modified files, and uses them instead of the original files.[8D] It should be possible to do something similar with equipment. That means that distributing the scenario will require several sub-folders, but you won't need to mod the executable any more. One downside is that both players will need to install the scenario, but I think that most people would anyway.[:)]

Ralph

ORIGINAL: ColinWright
Mm. Well one certainly could modify any tile in any way one wanted, but then how would one get the program to use that tile? If one just replaced the original tile with it, then it would be used by all scenarios -- and no one else could play your scenario as it was intended to be played without similarly permanently altering their game.

The alternative could be to instruct players to copy all tiles and save them elsewhere before replacing the original tiles with yours and launching the scenario. This doesn't really strike me as an improvement over a modified .exe that permits one to just call up different tiles for that particular scenario.

Does this let you replace the 'Numbers' file and the various unit type files?

ORIGINAL: ColinWright
Does this let you replace the 'Numbers' file and the various unit type files?

Colin asked, sheepishly.

Any graphic file can be replaced.

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: ColinWright
Does this let you replace the 'Numbers' file and the various unit type files?

Colin asked, sheepishly.

Any graphic file can be replaced.

Sure -- but will TOAW III let you call it up? Point is, suppose I want to replace the higher level HQ icon with a 'mountain artillery' icon for whatever reason.

Now, will TOAW III somehow let my scenario call up that icon -- or would people who wanted to play my scenario have to copy their original higher level HQ icon to another file and then replace it with mine in the graphics folder every time they wanted to play my scenario?

Right now, I can create a modified scenario that calls up my 'Numsee' file rather than the 'numbers' file. You can chuck 'Numsee' in your graphics folder and forget it. It'll only get called up if you open my modified .exe; other people's scenarios will run just fine and still call up the original 'Numbers' file.

So does OPART III let you do something similar -- or would those who wanted to play my scenarios as designed have to copy and paste, replace, and then restore every time they wanted to first play 'Seelowe' and then go back to 'Fire in the East'?

My more immeadiate concern is that it come with an "Idiots Guide to Unit MOdification". I know Matrix will not issue something that wont work. It may not please EVERY grognard, but they usually own COW anyway. It sounds like it (unit editor thingee) will work for me, if it comes with instructions.