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I'm running my CV TF's against Japan out of Iwo Jima and Saipan. I want to blast shipping.. TF's, ships in port, etc. But no matter what I do the damn air attacks always go against factories/supply depots. If I set the bombers to NI they just dont attack anything.

Last turn I sent 12 CV's in 4 TF's to destination Saesbo (where many Japanese TF's have been sitting) with standoff 2 and target split half for ships in port and half for Task Forces. I eneded up with every single one attacking Tokyo's depot/factories instead and got exactly one port strike.. and it wasn't on Saesbo.

Every TF has a good leader and the HQ they are under is always topped at 200 PP, so the TFs must have plenty.

How do I get at the shipping? I've lost 2 Essexes to kamimazes over the last 8 turns!

-KL

Excellent question, I've suffered the same frustrations.

C'mon PacWar vets, throw us less knowledgable sorts a bone here!

PacWar has always had this problem. Here is what you do.

1. Give your air combat TFs a destination with a standoff range of 1, assign all airgroups a NI mission so they don't get wasted on useless airfield attack missions. Make sure you are in early '44 with the larger carrier fighter groups equipped with F6Fs, and possess at least 3-4 carrier groups with 2 CVs and 2CVLs or 3CVs each. These groups must operate in mutual support in order to survive land based air attacks. The TFs should have flak values of at least 4000-4200; in early '44, for the lowest numbered TF, 3500 for the remainder. This is due to the AI propensity to attack the lowest numbered TF, if all of the TF mission types are identical. As by late '44, the flak values should be in the 5500 range for your air combat TFs.

2. The NEXT week, assign one or two TFs with destination and base as the same, with reaction range as desired; then these TFs will launch strikes against ships in port; before they return to base. I prefer to leave at least one TF with the original destination and standoff range. This TF will be assured to be in a position to launch strikes against ships fleeing the target port. This is most unlikely to change in the coming patch.

This obviously has the risk of exposing carrier TFs for a week for nothing to gain; but it is just about the only way to get strikes against ships in port. For some reason, some destination bases will allow airstrikes to be launched against them by a TF with the base itself as the TF's target. Due to the AI's inability to pull ships out of dangerous ports, you can rationalize this behavior as a 'balancing' mechanism. In human v human play, the Japanese side gets a large advantage due to this effect.

In the pre v2.0 version, one could rotate TFs between movement to a base the first week, hitting the port the and returning to base the second week, and starting the process over the third week. You can still do this in V2.0+, but... the screwed up replentishment routines now makes getting replentishment TFs into a position to support the fleet more problematic. If the replentishment routine could just be changed back to the pre v2.0 version...

Here is an example:

Air Combat TF's 50, 51, 52, 53 are to be used in attacks for ships in port. All air groups are set to the NI mission. A replentishment TF is created. The home base is say Rabaul, the target destination is Tinian. TF 50 is given the highest flak rating, since it will move first and be the target for all of the Japanese land based attacks. Halsey is placed as TF 50 commander, or commander of the controlling HQ. The HQ target is Tinian.

Land based heavy bomber groups are assigned to bomb the airfields of the target destination and any airfield around the target which have large air groups. This reduces the threat to the TFs. All TFs, including the replentishment, are given orders to Tinian with a standoff range of 1. The Japanese will launch land based air attacks against the air combat TFs. The carrier fighters will chop through these air groups. This ends the first week.

The second week, replentish the TFs. Give priority to the TFs which will stay with the destination set at Tinian. If any TF has a carrier which took a major hit, that TF will return to base. Select two of the four TFs which are in the best shape to stay with the destination as Tinian. These two TF will launch strikes against fleeing ships and be in position to launch strikes against the port in the next week. The other two TFs will be given identical destination and base assignments, and a reaction range you feel comfortable with. These TFs should launch strikes against ships in port. Set the HQ target to the destination/base of the returning TFs, in order to maximize their PPs. The bright side to this is that the TFs that are returning to base will strike any port in range with ships in port.

This process can be repeated the third week with the two TFs now at Rabaul being given destinations and the two setting off of Tinian given identical destination/base assignments. By using SIGINT, replentishment TFs and this tactic, the allied side can clear any base of Japanese ships from early '44 on. Hope this helps.

And then there's the other problem.

Once you have isolated these particular ships and have managed to get the TF commander to recognize that you really want him to attack the TF in that hex or the ships in that port, you can have a situation much as this. Two CVLs or two CVEs are in port, and they are attacked and set ablaze - oh about a level five fire. There are also other ships in ports, BBs, CAs, CLs, etc. The next five raids each hit the already burning and obviously out of the war if not sinking carriers with anywhere from 150 to 200 hits for each raid, ignoring every other ship in port. By this time the carriers are very near being reduced to their component atoms, and the other ships are peacefully getting up steam to leave on the return portion of the turn. Wonderful, isn't it?



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God Bless;
Rev. Rick, the tincanman

Thanks for taking the time to give that detailed reply Ricochet, I'm sure it will help. I think I've actually done this myself and gotten attacks on ports, but I had just attributed it to random luck.

RevRick, your point is well taken, but Richochet never claimed it was a perfect solution!

Don't u just hate the "bomb an entire Air TF repeatedly, yet your planes only attack the smallest CVE present" syndrome...especially when you hit the CVE about 150 times, it's in flames, then u get a surface reaction move with your battleships, hit it with 50 16" shells, 200 5" shells, a coupla torpedoes, yet it still heads back to mainland Japan, gets torpedoed repeatedly by submarines in route, yet still makes it to port? Only to have it survive the war unscathed in a port you bombed daily for 2 years. Grrrrr!

Wow.. talk about frustrating!

Its March '45 and I have landed and taken two Japanese cities (kitakyushu and Takamatsu); I'm running my CV TF's out of Iwo Jima, port size 6, with 7th Fleet HQ headed by Nimitz located there.

Over the last 12 turns I have tried everything with my carriers, including the tactics kindly supplied in this thread. I am getting nothing! The replenished TF's simply return to base without doing anything.

Much of the Jap fleet is sitting at Saesbo damaged by LBA (thank god for them, they seem to recognize ships when they see them). In addition to the above tactics I have also tried moving TF's between friendly bases each turn always setting the home base the same as the destination and then setting a reaction range. I have not had a reaction move in the last 3 months of war. Jap TF's have moved by every other turn and LBA attacks them while in the adjacent hex Halsey and his Essex class CV's sit there and twiddle their thumbs.

And of course simply setting a destination and specifying ships in port as the move option target never works..

So as the home islands slowly become occupied the Japanese navy survives simply by sitting in port or moving in TF's out of range from LBA.. because the US carriers are simply too stupid to attack them. It's enough to make you chew your own foot off.

I feel better now after venting.

-KL

Klud... Chew your own foot off? ( Is that with normal condiments or something spicier? VBG ... just wondering...)
Anyway having had the same problems and being the airedale sort I generally find a close enough base and forward in B-25's and A-20's set on NI and it takes about 3-4 turns but they do go after the fleets and then the fleets run and it becomes the Marianas Turkey Shoot for the CV air arms! have sucessfully done this about 5 times. Sometimes they do NOT run out of port and eventually NI sends them to the bottom anyway.
NOTE: It IS frustrating setting this all up with supply fleets but worth it when the shooting starts.
Jim

[This message has been edited by moore4807 (edited November 21, 2000).]

I was talking to Rich about this, but, it seems to occur a lot in the original version as well. This probably has something to do with Japan being littered with both high numbers of airfields, along with factories and civilian population. These are high victory points if attacked, and can actually be more important (points wize) than sinking a few ships.

Jeremy

I'm sure you are right, points wise as you say. But fun wise, bombing factories, depots and land units can't compare to flaming up a port full of ships!

It just goes to show how short sited I am to lessen my chance to win the game for a little short term entertainment.