Tutorial 6 - Aircraft

[yeknod]

Hi

I'm going through the tutorials but at this point it appears that my passive sensors are not able to pick up the Airbus. I gain a visual identification as it flys past rather than gain an unidentified contact north of my position.

Any help to get a passive contact as the tutorial suggests.. I'm using the ANW 2.0 database?

Thanks in advance!

[yeknod]

Same results playing with sensors on full reality - Airbus picked up only as a visual. Any ideas about how to correct this?

[yeknod]

Or is it because Stealth Airbus is riding the waves at 31m? A bit better with active radar

[Bucks]

yeknod,

There's a problem with the ODB and the scenario seems broken. Looks to me like there's an error somewhere with the Perry's ESM system.

I've included a screenshot from the Tutorial III scenario using my DB, and I've made some annotations to explain what's meant to be happening. I'll make another addition to the thread with an explanation of what your seeing.

Sorry about the DB issue, I'll get it listed for AGSI so the ODB gets looked at for 3.8.1.

Cheers

Darren

[Bucks]

Part 2:

In this screenshot you'll see there are actually 2 Airbuses in the scenario. The "Sea Skimmer", and the ESM contact you should have detected to the north.

Cheers

Darren

[yeknod]

Darren

Thanks for the reply and explanations.

Although the idea of an uber-kewl commercial Airbus taking its passengers for marine mamal spotting is intensely exciting for any game to simulate I think I rather prefer your database to mine... um, any chance you could direct me to a DB that will bring my imagination back to reality?

[Bucks]

yeknod,

I've sent you a PM in reply to your DB request. I'll be releasing the public Beta version of the HUD3 shortly. I'm working on a timeline to hopefully coincide with the release of 3.8.1 - (less scen rebuilding for me). I'm hoping it goes along way to correcting some of these errors we've had with the standard database since the days of Harpoon 2.

Cheers

Darren

[BurntFingers]

ORIGINAL: Bucks

I'll be releasing the public Beta version of the HUD3 shortly. I'm working on a timeline to hopefully coincide with the release of 3.8.1 - (less scen rebuilding for me).Darren

Most excellent news!

[shunwick]

Indeed.

Best wishes,

[yeknod]

Thanks Darren, I appreciate the help. I hope your work goes smoothly.

[FreekS]

deleted!

[yeknod]

I got the Tutorials running correctly thanks to Bucks.. but, no, no, no... how come my Mighty Perry and its 76mm is out-gunned by an Alligator / Tapir dual 57mm... the shame?

[Anonymous]

[Deleted by Admins]

[yeknod]

Thanks for the tip.. interesting, it gives me that option in the ANW Database 2.0 but not PlayersDB 7 or Buck's beta... hmmmm, the complexity of this game is about to explode my brain...

[Flankerk]

Just tried some of the tutorials as rebuilt on Harpoon HQ and they seem fine, the guns firing etc.
 
The thread here suggests various introductory scenarios :-
 
http://www.harpoonhq.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4618

[Anonymous]

[Deleted by Admins]

[yeknod]

Thanks everyone, I tried Tutorial 4 with the ANW 2.0 database and my Mighty Perry out-gunned the Tapir - Alligator which didn't shoot back.. such a difference in databases.. the 76mm ASuW rounds were far more effective.

So I guess the great question is, which database to use with ANW 3.8?

Thanks for all the links to newbie scenarios.

Are there any 3rd party Excel spreadsheets that lists platforms and weapons ranges and effectivelness and sensors.. .it'd be good to compare equipment and spot advantages and disadvantages?

[Anonymous]

[Deleted by Admins]

[TonyE]

ORIGINAL: yeknod

Are there any 3rd party Excel spreadsheets that lists platforms and weapons ranges and effectivelness and sensors.. .it'd be good to compare equipment and spot advantages and disadvantages?

There is the HHQ Database encyclopedia http://www.harpoondatabases.com with lots of nicely laid out information.

I'm achingly slowly expanding the reporting capabilities of dbComp http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.ph ... howfile=18 (I should have another update to it posted some time this coming weekend, if not earlier, same URL). You point to the database directory you want to look at (old database), once that import finishes you will find most of the data imported into the l... and t2... tables for use to craft your own reports. Or use the few I've done, JanMasterson has done a number as well and I'll probably ask if I can throw them into dbComp for the next release.

[Bucks]

ORIGINAL: yeknod

Thanks for the tip.. interesting, it gives me that option in the ANW Database 2.0 but not PlayersDB 7 or Buck's beta... hmmmm, the complexity of this game is about to explode my brain...

Yeknod,

It's not so much the complexity, rather the various "philosophical" approaches to the game taken by the various Database Editors.

The HUD-II/HUD3 and the PDB platforms based on the HUD-II database use my "happy medium" approach. Originally in Harpoon 2, most gun mounts would be loaded with multiple ammunition types. Normally these would consist of: armour piercing ammo, General HE ammo, a dual purpose type (AAW/ASuW) and a fragmentation type for use against air targets.

Unfortunately the game engine has no way of determining the correct ammunition to use in each specific case. As Dale has pointed out:

I'd have to check (I'm on another comp at the moment) but I'd have to say that it's because the Perry's Mk75 was loaded with an AAW rounds as opposed to an anti-surface round.

The game really needs an internal check so that it can logically decide which target to engage in cases where we have multiple rounds loaded on a mount with :

Darren's "psuedo code"

3 Gun ammo types:

General Purpose HE - Valid targets - ALL
AAW Frag - Valid targets - Aircraft/Missile
Semi Armour Piercing - All surface targets, not air capable.

- Check for Target Type
- Target Type is: Aircraft
- Exclude gun ammo without aircraft listed as valid target
- (Leaves GP - HE and Frag rounds)
- Check for greater %hit value - (AAW Frag Ammo say 45% vs 30%)
- Fire AAW Frag rounds

There are other issues and I don't want to "overload" people with this stuff but that, would make a good place to start for mounts with multiple ammo types so the system has some functionality to it.

I choose to settle for a generic DP ammo type - "dual purpose" round for guns. I've also added magazines for the guns rather than store all of the ammunition on the mount itself. Even modern guns only have a small component of their total available ammunition stored "on mount". As we move back in history, we find a larger component of the guns ammunition stored in an armoured magazine.

Dale again:

The ANW DB uses the H4 mini rules that specify different ranges for AAW and ASuW guns. Most guns have multiple variants of both types but for the sake of simplicity I just made the AAW and ASuW types. If I wanted to be super realistic I could put in all the different types of ammo that gun uses...

My dual purpose gun ammunition is a COMPROMISE, to achieve a working solution for a general gunnery system. I've had to make a few decisions that we are presently examining within the HUD3 design team. For instance I have averaged the ammunition range so that HUD3 guns will have a shorter ASuW range than the minis data and a slightly longer range for AAW rounds. I am still using the minis %hit chances and I'm presently updating the damage inflicted. I've also made changes to the rate of fire to reflect the different clases of gun system. Dale's made a point about simplicity and I have to back him on that. You can go too far...

I hope I've provided an insight into why there are so many databases and if nothing more a brief examination of how I approach the work I do while editing the HUD3. We've also had Dale briefly explain his approach and while his style maybe be different we are both aiming at incorporating the current Harpoon 4.1 miniatures system and annex data into our H3ANW databases.

Cheers

Darren