Matrix Games Forums

Any Urban maps in Karkov?

Reason why I ask is because of the infantry. Reading the threads here and there about PC is that the infantry don't get a chance for some close combat action.

Most of the maps all seem like tank country, which is fine and explains why the infantry doesn't last very long. I blame the terrain more than the way infantry is handled.

Some compare the infantry with CM. Well, in CM, once you lose more than half your squad it becomes a micro manage nightmare watching you men standup, then drop prone ... standup, drop prone. You'd think you were at a Catholic mass with all the standing and kneeling. So, basically they become useless at that point ... all they do is draw fire.

I prefer a less micro managed infantry, such as PCOWS. All I want to know about infantry is whether they can fight. If they can't, I don't want to micromanage their rout and even waste resources and time on chasing the routed enemy. Poof, they're gone, let them reform after the battle, which is a nice way to handle it. Plus, I like the way the tank crews are done ... they abandon the tank, poof. No need to watch them cower in the bush.

Anyway, just my opinion. If gamers want to micromanage the infantry that's fine, have at it. But to me, the terrain makes the most difference.

Thanks for listening.
Rob

Terrain is boring, I'd rather micromanage infantry. And in CM they didn't just stand up and lay down like you made it out they did. They would kneelup and fire and then go prone again. So, they were getting their shots off just in a disrupted posture as they should have done. If you'd just lost 5 of your squad and they were your buddies you wouldn't be so apt to stand and fire either unless you were ignorant or lost your mind and decided to pull an Audy Murphy.

ORIGINAL: Mraah
I prefer a less micro managed infantry, such as PCOWS. All I want to know about infantry is whether they can fight. If they can't, I don't want to micromanage their rout and even waste resources and time on chasing the routed enemy. Poof, they're gone, let them reform after the battle, which is a nice way to handle it. Plus, I like the way the tank crews are done ... they abandon the tank, poof. No need to watch them cower in the bush.

The High Water map is probably the most urban overall but it has so many buildings only those within German lines are defended. This represents some of the suburbs near the city of Kharkov itself. In this scene there are some houses and a couple of large buildings, trees then a large section of houses in the distance. Other maps have less amounts of buildings but they are often in clusters to form villages.

Infantry has more fight in Kharkov than in the original PCOWS as squads take 3 step losses in casualties. They can be suppressed, pinned or routed with or without step losses. Once suppressed or pinned they can't be ordered to do much and when routed they can't be ordered at all. As in PCOWS healthy squads have some anti-tank close assault ability but that is at grenade ranges of about 25m. Squads with one step losses aren’t very effective against tanks and those with two can’t close assault at all.

Infantry in buildings and foxhole are difficult to take on as they are well protected.

Rob,

Our focus is not urban combat in this release, so no full urban maps. The historical campaigns also didn't get to the urban areas, but what we do have are some historical maps of the villages and towns they did fight in.

Infantry does have a tough time in the open, but there are plenty of woods and also foxholes and trenches on some maps to give them good solid cover. Also, the new Soviet campaign is not tank-heavy and the random battles can be set to have absolutely zero tanks if you like.

Regards,

- Erik

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

Terrain is boring, I'd rather micromanage infantry. And in CM they didn't just stand up and lay down like you made it out they did. They would kneelup and fire and then go prone again. So, they were getting their shots off just in a disrupted posture as they should have done. If you'd just lost 5 of your squad and they were your buddies you wouldn't be so apt to stand and fire either unless you were ignorant or lost your mind and decided to pull an Audy Murphy.

Ravinhood,

Thanks for replying. Perhaps it was the constant animation of the men that made me go off the deep end with CM.

Rob

Mobius,

Thanks for the screen shot. Very nice. Forgive me, I had Stalingrad on my mind so I jumped ahead too far .

Rob

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Rob,

Our focus is not urban combat in this release, so no full urban maps. The historical campaigns also didn't get to the urban areas, but what we do have are some historical maps of the villages and towns they did fight in.

Infantry does have a tough time in the open, but there are plenty of woods and also foxholes and trenches on some maps to give them good solid cover. Also, the new Soviet campaign is not tank-heavy and the random battles can be set to have absolutely zero tanks if you like.

Regards,
- Erik

Erik,

Ok, I'm jumping too far ahead. I admit I'm not well schooled on east front terrian not to mention historical battles locations. I'm a western European nut with it's densly popular areas and terrain features.

I'm looking forward to PCK!!

Thank you.
Rob