Matrix Games Forums

Attack on Kamchatka - one of my favourite stock scens with the latest beta, 3.9.4.6.

Database: Standard Database
Aircraft Logistics on
Nukes activated

0. Start: April, 7th, 1993, 01:00 PM

1. Time: 01:25: Vampires approaching Poronaysk !

2. Time: 01:26: Impact, SA-10 gone

3. Time: 01:49: Vampires approaching Sobolevo

4. Time: 01:51: Vampires approaching Icha

5. Time: 01:55: Soboleva is completely gone - that must have been nukes

6. Time: 02:02: Vampires approaching Petropavlovsk

7. Time: 02:04: Boom! Impact! Runway destroyed; all hangars destroyed, aircrafts grounded destroyed [:(]

8. Time: 03:25: my brave Beard-D has found the CVBG ! Now there is hope again

9. Time: 04:30: I have surrounded the CVBG with my bombers and the Oscar is close enough to launch her deadly Shipwrecks

Strike! Coordinated attack! At least some Shipwrecks break through and hit one carrier. The second salvo hits two non-carriers.

Where are the carriers fighter´s? [&:]

10. Time: 04:45: Lack of respect always ends in desasters. I ordered my Fencers with standoff weapons to attack. They can launch their Kingbolts, but afterwards are all shot down. This was too early. Patience is a virtue. [:@]

11. Time: 04:55: My northern SAG is under attack - looks like air launched Harpoons. One ship gets damaged.

12. I´m out of Standoff missiles for both the bombers and the Fencers. Too bad. Intended or database error? Will check that in my H2AE version running on my old PC.

I start surrounding the CVBG with my subs and SAG´s, but all are out of shooting distance right now.

13. One of my Bear-D´s has been shot down. [:@] Too close to the carrier group. Looks like that now a second wave of carrier fighters has launched

14. Time: 08:20: Hornet attack on Icha! The Foxbats fight for their survival, but in the end they are all downed by the Hornets. [:(]

15. Few minutes later: Hornet attack on Opala; loss of more ac and installations

16. Meanwhile I have lost contact with the Nimitz...

17. Time: 09:05: And that was it! The nimitz is gone and Victory is mine.

Conclusions:
- For the first time since ANW is around, e.g. since 2006, this scenario behaves very similiar again to the way it was intended to do and did under H2 and H3 until 3.6.X. This is a major improvement. At last this is the first impression. Couldn´t test ASW in this scen.
- The Standard Database seems to work in this scen, but I´ll check it.
- The Carrier group was weakly protected by the figters. This scen ought to be rebuild and it was rebuilt with other databases. Will check how the CVBG defends there.
- No crash, no problem with the current beta.

Took a look at it in the scenario editor and found some strange things relating to magazins and loadouts. It seems like the carrier´s magazins and the aircrafts loadouts do not fit, resulting sometimes in minimal loadouts or no reload possibilities. Thus the AI cannot fight for a long time.

Checked that in the old H3 version. There the Standard database and the aircraft loadouts always fit together and there is enough ordnance in the carrier´s magazine to reload the aircraft multiple times.

Any clue?

I believe that you are speaking of these two problems:

• Ammo dumps emptied
  
  Ammo dumps in all ODb scenarios have been emptied of weapons for aircraft.
• Wrong loadout descriptions
  
  Helix helos are show the wrong loadout descriptions. Display is Mk44 torp, but they revert to Minimal when launched.

IMO, the first problem was likely caused by one of two possible explanations:

[ol][*]A faulty scenario editor release. The ScenEditor has a function that exports all the weapons loaded in the various ammo dumps and magazines within a scenario. Unfortunately, the version released with 3.7.0 and 3.8.0 was faulty. The information was often incomplete. Therefore, anyone using this function to re-make scenarios often lost track of the various weapons previously loaded. What made this problem even more insidious was the fact that not all units were affected. Some bases would re-load properly whilst others would not and the scenario editor would not likely notice the problem without a detailed examination of the file.

[*]AGSI simply forgot to re-load the files. This is more likely since every magazine and ammo dump has been emptied or restored to their original defaults (usu. empty). If the AGSI editor hit the Re-build All Magazines command without first using the Export command, all the weapons would be wiped out and the records lost. I believe this is what happened.

AGSI has tried to brush this problem under the rug by saying that the ODb scenarios were meant to be played with Aircraft Logistics disabled. (This would mean that all aircraft would have unlimited munitions.) This excuse does not appear plausible since this setting has not been mentioned anywhere in the documentation, battleset description, or scenario orders.[/ol]
The second problem with the aircraft loadouts is due to the modification of the various loadouts within the database. When loadouts are significantly changed or deleted, every scenario with aircraft that previously depended upon those loadouts must be manually edited. A new loadout must be selected for the previously deleted one or else the plane attempts to launch and is immediately set to 'minimal' loadout (empty).

The haphazard method by which loadouts are changed within the OriginalDB and the ANWDB (both distributed by AGSI), means that these types of problems will likely appear over, and over, again. Any oter databases which employ this editorial policy will likely suffer the same consequences.

PlayersDB scenarios are immune to either of these two problems due to the editorial policy of, "Append only, never delete."

Harpoon ANW users can get the:
Complete Harpoon ANW Library

Took a deeper look into the scen and found that two red bases seems to be broken. Their aircraft are unavailable for pre-defined missions. Many red missions thus have no ac assigned. Similiar with the US CVBG: Many missions without ac assigned.

I´ll rebuild the red bases, the red missions and the missing formation patrols as well as assigning ac to the missions for the carrier group. I´ll use the PDB version of the scen since here the carrier´s magazines and the aircraft´s loadouts already have been fixed.

In the original version these problems come on top of those related to the lost/broken bases and missions.

I´ve rebuilt the scenario. Now everything should work as it was intendend back in 1995 or so

The updated scen is included in the latest PDB release. Have fun!

I've had an opportunity to play this revised scenario from both sides in H3 and it is thoroughly enjoyable.  Although it still suffers from the TLAM not firing in ANW, one can only hope that this bug will be corrected when the next patch is released.  Thanks for your efforts in fixing the scenario.