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I have been thinking and wondering. I never play Allies so I don't know if this is true or not but I thought I would ask...


What is the real penalties for running out of PPs ? Basically if you don't withdraw ships, air groups or meet garrison requirements what penalties do you really suffer ?

Air Groups: Do you lose anything by not withdrawing them other than PPs ?
Ship: Same ?
Bases: The base becomes damaged - but the allies don't really care - they don't need resources, oil, etc...

Other than changing HQs for units and changing leaders is having 0 PPs a penalty or just an inconvenience ? What do you Allied Fan Boys say...

Xargun

You Loose  Victory Points (VP) if you Ignore Garrison Requirements

You can actually go into the negative for PP's. The penalty is that when the time comes for you to want to change an HQ (most likely to unrestrict a unit), you won't have the "cash" handy to make your purchase.

THere will be a whole bunch of Allied divisions that cannot leave their home territory.....and that's a big minus

new Allied players need to beware on this point. In my last PBEM with Joe, i was allies and lost track of hidden PP penalties for not withdrawing units at their appointed times and as a result i accrued quite the deficit which delayed my ability to free up units. Major headache while trying to build up my defenses.

Ahh so you go negative ? And a lot of the Allied land power needs to have its HQ changed to use the units ?

As Japan I have some of that but with no ships being withdrawn and very few airgroups I don't see any impact if I ignore it. But with the larger amounts for the allies I wondered what the penalty would be.

Xargun

not unless you want to tap China/Manchuria/Korea for troops. There are some nice juicy divisions sitting there that can be very useful in the Pacific.

True - but what I mean is that there are less PP sinks for Japan than for the allies.

Xargun

yes....the Allied side has a good number of air squadron and ship withdrawl requirements early on, particularily on the West Coast.

ORIGINAL: Xargun

Ahh so you go negative ? And a lot of the Allied land power needs to have its HQ changed to use the units ?

As Japan I have some of that but with no ships being withdrawn and very few airgroups I don't see any impact if I ignore it. But with the larger amounts for the allies I wondered what the penalty would be.

Xargun

If you keep a daily penalty of 50PP of airgroups (which if I remember correctly is just a couploe of groups) on the map as the Japanese then each month you are missing out on pulling an infantry division from Manchria into somewhere more useful. In a year you have the use of 2 airgroups but miss out on 6 divisions! No brainer for me.

ORIGINAL: Yakface
If you keep a daily penalty of 50PP of airgroups (which if I remember correctly is just a couploe of groups) on the map as the Japanese then each month you are missing out on pulling an infantry division from Manchria into somewhere more useful. In a year you have the use of 2 airgroups but miss out on 6 divisions! No brainer for me.

Correct. But since I never play the allies I was wondering if it affected the allies the same way. Don't the US get enough troops without having to pull units from restricted commands to win the war easily ?

Xargun

As others have mentioned no PP no "cash on hand" to free up ground divisions. Also very useful to buy units that you'd like to have like B-24s. I also go through all the units at home and "sell" some for PPs. This applies to air units. The reality is you probably will find yourself in a situation where you can't possibly deploy and use all the squadrons you get. The basing and support realities in a battlefield that expands usually prevents it. As it already stands I'm have swarms of aircraft ponuding my opponent and still have squadrons at rear area bases doing nothing. Some are spending their time shooting up bypassed garrisons. As I move forward and capture some airbases I'll deploy these rear area squadrons.

Some air squadrons I sold because I could never find anything really useful for them to do. I had at one point 12,000 PP banked. That was very handy to have.

12,000????

wow...you could free up several corps with that.

ORIGINAL: Xargun

ORIGINAL: Yakface
If you keep a daily penalty of 50PP of airgroups (which if I remember correctly is just a couploe of groups) on the map as the Japanese then each month you are missing out on pulling an infantry division from Manchria into somewhere more useful. In a year you have the use of 2 airgroups but miss out on 6 divisions! No brainer for me.

Correct. But since I never play the allies I was wondering if it affected the allies the same way. Don't the US get enough troops without having to pull units from restricted commands to win the war easily ?

Xargun

Considering that things like parts of the 2nd Marine Division start/arrive assigned to a restricted command, NO. Many of the early SeaBee units come assigned to the West Coast also.

ORIGINAL: Nomad
Considering that things like parts of the 2nd Marine Division start/arrive assigned to a restricted command, NO. Many of the early SeaBee units come assigned to the West Coast also.

Ahh good. I like to hear this. So (at least in the early game) a lot of the US power is restricted so if the allied player is keeping ships / air groups he will be weak on the ground. Sounds fine to me..

Thanks

Xargun

I recently went on a shopping spree. If it comes down to an invasion of the home islands it will be good to have some extra troops.

Does anyone know if the game assumes the War in Europe ends at the historical date and grounds units from Europe become available for deployment in the Pacific? I looked at the reinforcement schedule and it doesn't look like that's the case.

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

12,000????

wow...you could free up several corps with that.

[quote]ORIGINAL: sfbaytf

.

Does anyone know if the game assumes the War in Europe ends at the historical date and grounds units from Europe become available for deployment in the Pacific? I looked at the reinforcement schedule and it doesn't look like that's the cas

Absolutely is the case. Look at the First U. S. Army, Eighth Air Force, All those units arriving in the UK in 45 and 46, the Russian units etc. etc[;)]

That's good to know. I sometimes have difficulties sorting through all of the screens. I really should take the time to get trakker working, instead of doing everything in my head.

ORIGINAL: Xargun

ORIGINAL: Yakface
If you keep a daily penalty of 50PP of airgroups (which if I remember correctly is just a couploe of groups) on the map as the Japanese then each month you are missing out on pulling an infantry division from Manchria into somewhere more useful. In a year you have the use of 2 airgroups but miss out on 6 divisions! No brainer for me.

Correct. But since I never play the allies I was wondering if it affected the allies the same way. Don't the US get enough troops without having to pull units from restricted commands to win the war easily ?

Xargun

No, about half of the units arriving on the West Coast are restricted and you will need to spend PPs as you do not have enough units to defend the SoPac and OZ.

I am near 9/42 in my pbemail game as the Allies and I have almost no PPs in the pool. I have used them for, buying infantry units out of restricted HQ, buying out restricted air groups, upgrading my leaders in brigades and divisions, upgrading my leaders in airgroups and changing out my lousy sub and major ship commanders.

Biggest problem is that a lot of ships start with the wrong type of commander, and many air units are commanded by lower officers with low skills. It is a must to change them out.

One other big pain in the butt is TF formation. If you use the auto commander select button about 75 % of the time the computer picks an admiral that is not suited for the TF you are building. This is maddening and costs a hell of a lot of PPs to put good admiral in charge every time. This happens even when there are plenty of qualified officers available. I don't get this one as it is a steady drain on PPs that I don't have.

I have been caught a few times with minor ships due for withdrawal at sea but if you are careful it is not a problem. However you can forget about holding onto capital ships. It costs a king's ransom. It was possible in Witp but not so in AE.

I like the ways PPs work now, much better than WITP where the Allied player never really had to worry. However, if this is not the case with the Japanese players, and they have plenty of PPs in 1942, then it is borked.

ORIGINAL: crsutton


I am near 9/42 in my pbemail game as the Allies and I have almost no PPs in the pool. I have used them for, buying infantry units out of restricted HQ, buying out restricted air groups, upgrading my leaders in brigades and divisions, upgrading my leaders in airgroups and changing out my lousy sub and major ship commanders.

I'm in May 1944, and believe me, the PP situaiton gets worse, not better. I have divisions on the WC I've been trying to save to buy out since 1942, and at over 2000 per I never get ahead on the rent. I don't do intense commander swapping and have only messed up on withdrawls a few times (maybe 60-80 PP penalty), and I find that there's not nearly enough to do what I need to do. I think--maybe, designer decision--that the command-shift costs in SE Asia are too high, and I did quite a few of those in 1942 to organize to support a Burma advance. I've never been able to afford to use the NZ troops as historic; I ate up that bank buying out WC restricted air groups in late 1943 to get them forward and useful. And so it goes.

I realize that the game is about trade-offs, but I personally think that a December 1941 PP accumulation rate is not the one available to FDR by summer of 1944. For me, 50 per day is too low to fully enjoy the decision-making the game allows. When I finish this "try out" game and start another, using all I've learned, I will play one of the harder scenarios, and I will use the editor to up the daily accumulation to 70 PP per day. I'd like to be able to do 25 for the first six months, then ramp up to 100 by 1945, but the engine doesn't allow that. So I'll try 70 and see if that gives me the flex to get some of those WC divisions into the war.