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Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 4:32 am
by Nibelung44
Hi,
First post, so before anything: It is a fine piece of a game that Matrix did here!!
Now, on to more serious matters [8D]
I found so far 2 derelict fleets in my game... A graveyard of 30 ships or so each time, a third being capital ships with adv techs. This is completely a game breaker shall I say! Just one of these puppies can blast away an AI fleet... when you have repaired a few, you are able to conquer an AI empire by yourself...
So, even if this is a cool feature, this is totally overpowered... That it is guarded by a few Kaltors don't do balance anything...
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:09 am
by taltamir
mmm... how about a beef gate?
that is... put a "drone" guarding it that kills anything that comes near it, but does not leave the area. you need to blow it up.. only once you do can you safely board the other ships...
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 8:58 am
by Fishman
There is a beefgate: A mob of Kaltors. Very mean. Additionally, most of the fleet is inoperable, and requires a lot of constructor time to repair and restore. Also, these things are not that uncommon. Many times I have encountered one only to find that the AI is already looting it!
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 9:29 am
by 2guncohen
ORIGINAL: Fishman
There is a beefgate: A mob of Kaltors. Very mean. Additionally, most of the fleet is inoperable, and requires a lot of constructor time to repair and restore. Also, these things are not that uncommon. Many times I have encountered one only to find that the AI is already looting it!
I have the same encounter but in the middle is only one ship or direlict base.
and around 30 of those space - scorpions.
First time i encounter this [:D]
Im curious how my 15 ships will handle it.
Maybe i should wait and build upp maybe 50 cheap escorts to soften the path...
I wonder are this encounters purely random generated
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 10:19 am
by Nibelung44
ORIGINAL: Fishman
There is a beefgate: A mob of Kaltors. Very mean. Additionally, most of the fleet is inoperable, and requires a lot of constructor time to repair and restore. Also, these things are not that uncommon. Many times I have encountered one only to find that the AI is already looting it!
mob of Kaltors only frighten children[;)]
Seriously, each construction ship you send will create your a very powerful ship in a few mn, and it don't even need to have fuel to repair... how about that? overpowered I say.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 10:53 am
by DasTactic
I am currently playing a game where I am repairing the last ship of the derelict fleet. I like what is going on here. Here's what happened...
1. Stumbled across derelicts
2. Destroyed the Kaltors
3. Sent constructor to start repairing. Told it to start on the Capital Ship first.
4. In the meantime I'd swapped and sold Galaxy maps to AI players.
5. Capital Ship was taking too long to repair so switched across to a Frigate.
6. Repaired a couple of Frigates and Destroyers and the Constructor needed to refuel.
7. Arrives back in system and the Capital Ship and a couple of Cruisers are missing. Hmmm.
8. Repair a Cruiser but make it hang around in the system.
9. Bloody AI Constructors start arriving to get at the pickings. Now I know what happened to the Capital Ship when my back was turned.
10. Decide the remaining Cruisers are worth going to war so destroy the AI Constructors.
11. Bad-boy rating goes through the roof and suddenly the rest of the galaxy doesn't like me any more.
Lovin' it.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:04 am
by taltamir
ORIGINAL: Fishman
There is a beefgate: A mob of Kaltors. Very mean. Additionally, most of the fleet is inoperable, and requires a lot of constructor time to repair and restore. Also, these things are not that uncommon. Many times I have encountered one only to find that the AI is already looting it!
There isn't always a mob of keltors... sometimes you find an old supership by itself.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:05 am
by taltamir
ORIGINAL: Das123
I am currently playing a game where I am repairing the last ship of the derelict fleet. I like what is going on here. Here's what happened...
1. Stumbled across derelicts
2. Destroyed the Kaltors
3. Sent constructor to start repairing. Told it to start on the Capital Ship first.
4. In the meantime I'd swapped and sold Galaxy maps to AI players.
5. Capital Ship was taking too long to repair so switched across to a Frigate.
6. Repaired a couple of Frigates and Destroyers and the Constructor needed to refuel.
7. Arrives back in system and the Capital Ship and a couple of Cruisers are missing. Hmmm.
8. Repair a Cruiser but make it hang around in the system.
9. Bloody AI Constructors start arriving to get at the pickings. Now I know what happened to the Capital Ship when my back was turned.
10. Decide the remaining Cruisers are worth going to war so destroy the AI Constructors.
11. Bad-boy rating goes through the roof and suddenly the rest of the galaxy doesn't like me any more.
Lovin' it.
This is why you NEVER give the AI your map...
if you do, it will immediately go for any goodies that you find... mmm, actually I think this is a good way to guess that an AI has deep inserted a spy.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 1:53 pm
by jscott991
Derelict fleets are incredibly cool and fun.
You're going to roll the AI with your own designs anyway. This isn't any more gamebreaking than allowing custom ships.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 3:36 pm
by taltamir
ORIGINAL: jscott991
Derelict fleets are incredibly cool and fun.
You're going to roll the AI with your own designs anyway. This isn't any more gamebreaking than allowing custom ships.
you could handicap yourself by turning on AI ship design and, on principle, never designing your own ship.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 4:04 pm
by Bartje
I do that, level playing field still provides for an easy game however.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 5:36 pm
by HsojVvad
If you find a derilict ship and find the game to easy, don't use it. Either keep it as a musem piece ( Battlestar Galatica [:D]) or disband it right away so the AI can't get it, or leave it for the AI. Too bad when you find it, you can't sell the location to the AI empires.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 5:43 pm
by DasTactic
I guess the point of this thread is to highlight the enormous boost in firepower you get when you stumble across a Capital Ship in the early-mid game. Your most powerful ship before the discovery may have a firepower rating of 20 and instantly you've got 400+ in one ship. You are given the choice to either scrap the ship for tech or to use the ship yourself.
Could the ship be nerfed based on your weapon tech knowledge? If you take the ships weapon tech and divide that by your current level it would nerf the figures down and would most likely make scrapping the ship more attractive. The full figure could be displayed in brackets. Eg. Firepower: 40 (450).
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:10 pm
by Astorax
ORIGINAL: Davor
If you find a derilict ship and find the game to easy, don't use it. Either keep it as a musem piece ( Battlestar Galatica [:D]) or disband it right away so the AI can't get it, or leave it for the AI. Too bad when you find it, you can't sell the location to the AI empires.
You can - sell them your Galaxy map! Heh.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 6:44 pm
by soundhack
I usually enjoy finding derelict fleets and fixing up the capital ships. Last night however I was more than a little peeved when as soon as my construction ship fixed one of the derelicts it instantly became owned (with corresponding color change) by an AI empire. Granted there was a single ship from the AI empire in the area, but at no point was the ship right on top of the derelict. How did the AI empire claim the fixed up ship when I had spent all the time with my construction ship right on top of it?
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 7:35 pm
by JosEPhII
I like this bit of "Fluff" it adds to the novelty of "Finding" stuff.
If you dismantle the ship you generally only get 1 tech upgrade. Maybe you go from AR3 shields to AR5 etc., I've never had 1 give me the Ultimate level of any tech. Unless of course that ship that gave me the Death Ray (happened once out of 25+ games so far) counts as an Ultimate tech level. [;)]
JosEPh
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 9:05 pm
by jscott991
ORIGINAL: taltamir
ORIGINAL: jscott991
Derelict fleets are incredibly cool and fun.
You're going to roll the AI with your own designs anyway. This isn't any more gamebreaking than allowing custom ships.
you could handicap yourself by turning on AI ship design and, on principle, never designing your own ship.
I would do this, except for the torpedo/bombard weapon "bug". Until the AI stops replacing torpedos with bombs, you really can't afford to let all ship designs be auto.
Plus, they don't put enough fuel tanks on ships and they don't put energy collectors on escorts.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 10:44 pm
by HsojVvad
I find it they put too many fuel tanks on a ship [:)]
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2010 11:28 pm
by jscott991
ORIGINAL: Davor
I find it they put too many fuel tanks on a ship [:)]
Really?
My default exploration and military ships are always having to run back for more fuel.
RE: Derelict fleets game breaker!
Posted: Sat May 01, 2010 1:42 am
by lostsm
ORIGINAL: soundhack
I usually enjoy finding derelict fleets and fixing up the capital ships. Last night however I was more than a little peeved when as soon as my construction ship fixed one of the derelicts it instantly became owned (with corresponding color change) by an AI empire. Granted there was a single ship from the AI empire in the area, but at no point was the ship right on top of the derelict. How did the AI empire claim the fixed up ship when I had spent all the time with my construction ship right on top of it?
this has happened to me a few times. it's a bug because the AI was never repairing and for some reason the game just gave it to the AI
all in all though these derelicts are OP by a lot. you can get so much tech/firepower from this it's insane. it's along the lines of getting that ruin that gives you 800 size building capacity and the deathzone ray thing.
the AI does send constructors at least, easily seen, and even your own constructors on auto go to the derelicts. the problem is that the AI will not heavily prioritize repairing the derelicts as a player would. i mean how many here have sent 2 or more constructors to finish the job? or send a military ship to protect the find? cancel orders on other constructors to rush to the site? the AI doesn't do this