Matrix Games Forums

I'm afraid to say there is a pathing issue...

I'm not sure you can do anything about it, as it's pretty prevailant in all the CC games I think.

In the attached pic, my tank unit was facing north (in the direction of the yellow arrow and sat at the base of the yellow arrow). I gave a move (might have been move fast) command to it, and it moved in the direction of the red arrows and is now facing south. I also had to walk another couple of armoured units through the start of this map.

It's actually decided to go over the river and through the wood?? [&:]

On top of that, I had another tank take off on it's own accord?

The tank started at the red circle and was sitting in DEFEND mode (I just checked the manual on DEFEND and it says nothing about using initiative). It then took off in the direction of the red arrows and was destroyed at the yellow circle by a Stug...which is quite far away. I'm not saying the Stug was too far to engage or be engaged, simply that my defending tank moved forward and was taken out by it...the tank was in no danger where it was defending and the Stug could not see it and vice versa...however the tank decided to move forward to the hedgerow and was destroyed.

Now I did have a Staghound recce car that was taken out to the South east - and that was visible (and indeed saw) the Stug. I initially thought the tank was moving forward because it knew something destroyed the Staghound...but the defend order in the manual says nothing about units moving away from their defend position to engage. It does say that a defending unit will find cover and engage targets of opportunity...but as I said, the Stug and Sherman could not see each other.

Is the manual wrong? Will units on defend move forward and attack??

That's disappointing, same OLD problem. Maybe it is for nostalgic reasons.[:D]

Like I said - maybe it's just something they can't "fix" as I'm sure it's in TLD and sure it was in CoI.

I don't mind walking my units (I used to give them big move orders), but when you walk them bit by bit and they refuse, that's tedious.

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Is the manual wrong? Will units on defend move forward and attack??

Thanks for your posting about the pathing issues you're encountering. They've been passed to the lead developer.

I wasn't able to find a reference in the manual with a search of "defend move" or "move forward" so I'm not sure what part of the manual you're referencing. I did copy the section about the Defend order below. If you found something not consistent with this please note the page number and section and I'll have a look. Thanks!

11.8 Defend
Units that have been ordered to Defend stop, seek whatever cover is available, and engage any target of opportunity. When ordered to Defend a blue arc appears above the unit; this indicates the direction of facing. To change the direction of defensive facing, left click the highlighted arc; a blue circle appears above the unit. Move the cursor to the arc, drag the arc to the point on the circle that you wish the unit to face, and left click again. Anti-tank guns and tanks rotate to face that direction and infantry seeks cover defending from that direction. Defending units engage enemies not in the blue arc, but only if those enemies are very close. Units that are defending will fire on targets of opportunity that they have at least a reasonable chance of killing. That’s equivalent to a yellow or green targeting circle.

Defend is the default setting for tanks. When not under specific orders, tanks Defend the area in front of them.

Oh one thing I'd add is that the game realism settings do have a bearing on what you described. Unless you have the realism settings checked for "never act on initiative" you'll find that after a period of inactivity units might begin to move on their own to seek out the enemy. So if this setting is NOT selected you'll need to periodically remind your teams what their orders are if you definitely want them to stay put.

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

Oh one thing I'd add is that the game realism settings do have a bearing on what you described. Unless you have the realism settings checked for "never act on initiative" you'll find that after a period of inactivity units might begin to move on their own to seek out the enemy. So if this setting is NOT selected you'll need to periodically remind your teams what their orders are if you definitely want them to stay put.

That will be it. That option is indeed unticked - so it was acting purely on initiative...I will turn that off. I didn't realise the impact of that option. I don't need my units running around acting on their own (and getting slaughtered) - if I wanted that, I'd go back to playing Theatre of War [:D][:D]

Thanks for that.

ORIGINAL: RD_Oddball

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Is the manual wrong? Will units on defend move forward and attack??

Thanks for your posting about the pathing issues you're encountering. They've been passed to the lead developer.

I wasn't able to find a reference in the manual with a search of "defend move" or "move forward" so I'm not sure what part of the manual you're referencing. I did copy the section about the Defend order below. If you found something not consistent with this please note the page number and section and I'll have a look. Thanks!

11.8 Defend
Units that have been ordered to Defend stop, seek whatever cover is available, and engage any target of opportunity. When ordered to Defend a blue arc appears above the unit; this indicates the direction of facing. To change the direction of defensive facing, left click the highlighted arc; a blue circle appears above the unit. Move the cursor to the arc, drag the arc to the point on the circle that you wish the unit to face, and left click again. Anti-tank guns and tanks rotate to face that direction and infantry seeks cover defending from that direction. Defending units engage enemies not in the blue arc, but only if those enemies are very close. Units that are defending will fire on targets of opportunity that they have at least a reasonable chance of killing. That’s equivalent to a yellow or green targeting circle.

Defend is the default setting for tanks. When not under specific orders, tanks Defend the area in front of them.

I think you misread my post there...I didn't search "defend move" or "move forward"...I was just asking if units on defend orders would move forward or not. I did find the section in the manual on defend and read it...I was confused why the unit moved on it's own...but it's all cleared up now with the initiative tick box. Thx

Ah gotcha. Sorry for the confusion. Glad info on realism settings helped.

As for the pathing issues...setting incremental waypoints helps a lot.

Or longer distance between wayppoints. I've crossed that particular bridge numerous times in testing when the tank was back at the next house south and set a single "move fast" around the next group of buoldings and the tank performed perfectly.

However that's not something you want to do without putting infantry through the area first if you know what I mean.

I think one thing to remember is in playing CC you're acting as the unit commmander, you give the orders, its up to your subordinants to carry those orders out. In this case your subordinants are 8mm high sprites who sometimes see a 'better' way of doing things[;)]

ORIGINAL: Southern_land
sometimes see a 'better' way of doing things

or are drunk [:D]

ORIGINAL: Southern_land

I've crossed that particular bridge numerous times in testing when the tank was back at the next house south and set a single "move fast" around the next group of buoldings and the tank performed perfectly.

Same here. I've also tested pathing on bridges and have had times where I can cross Nijmegen bridge with a single move command to the other end of the bridge and still others where I need to nurse it across.

Like you SL and... well.. SL too[:D] I use way points often too. It definitely helps.

Same here.  Way points make for better movement and control.  Tidy neat increments as Squad said, not huge bounding strides as the vehicle may not want to move and you will get the 'Cant go there' whine in your earphones.
 
Move in short bounds and keep a command vehicle in close proximity if possible.
 
With bridges I find that placing the final waypoint at the teeth of the bridge works well, then go from there.
 
Besides, armour should always avdance with infantry in terrain like this, not alone and in big bounds.  Also the vehicle will be more cognisant of threat and terrain changes if you use 'Move' or 'Sneak' commands.  Move fast makes the vehicle move toward it's objective fast with little regard to much anything else except overtly exposed and evident threats.

Guys - like I said in my post - I learned my lesson long ago in other CC games that generally it's better to nurse your units. I did use waypoints in this mission - The move order I gave was what?...25 yards? The tank refused to cross that bridge.

I got another tank to a similar start position over the bridge and gave it a move order similar and it started to twist round and looked like it was going to do the same thing...so I cancelled the move and gave it a waypoint ON the bridge and then a waypoint the other side and it travelled across it fine.

I don't really want my tanks crossing rivers unles absolutely necessary as they can get bogged down.

Yep you're right JudgeDredd. Didn't mean to minimize what you were saying.

Armor pathing seems once again to be horrible broken. At least for the human player. AI armor seems to behave quite adequate.

Me personally, I just get tired of having to babysit them through waypoints.

I like the game so far, but agree the pathing of the vehicles needs to be fixed. I have tried using waypoints alot, and even on the roads about 30% of the time the response is 'can't go there'.

The pathing in WaR seems to work pretty good

The Pathing issue is either a random bug they can`t fix or a corrupt file that happens when loading a new game.

First time out in the GC first scenaro I couldn`t get any 30th Corps Armor to move because of " Can`t go there"

On the second start No Problems on the same map with same units...not one " Can`t go there " Armor moved just fine.

Keep trying.... it`s worth it...looks and plays like a New Game.