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Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:43 am
by Jim Stevens
Good morning fellow gamers! Time for Jim's silly question for the day.
If I have the latest patch installed, how come I don't have an up-to-date manual?
Having asked that, is there a place to download just the latest manual?
As always, thanks for reading a responding. I do have to note that I seem to be spending more time in the forum reading what you guys post then playing the game. The information and insight is captivating. The comradery is very nice too.
Y'all have a nice day...
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:50 am
by Bullwinkle58
ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens
Good morning fellow gamers! Time for Jim's silly question for the day.
If I have the latest patch installed, how come I don't have an up-to-date manual?
Having asked that, is there a place to download just the latest manual?
As always, thanks for reading a responding. I do have to note that I seem to be spending more time in the forum reading what you guys post then playing the game. The information and insight is captivating. The comradery is very nice too.
Y'all have a nice day...
The forum IS the latest manual. It is highly unlikely there will ever be a new edition of the manual. Those who would, shouldn't. Those who could, won't.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:59 am
by Jim Stevens
That's too bad. What was the date or version number of the final manual?
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:19 am
by witpqs
ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens
That's too bad. What was the date or version number of the final manual?
First release AFAIK. However, if you look in the folders (the main AE folder but maybe there's a doc folder too?) you will see some additional PDF files. Those are important additional documentation released with patches later. Do note what Moose said: there are many changes beyond those. The patch notes (change notes, whatever) are important, but the biggest source of info both in terms of understanding new things and explaining many things is the forum.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:17 pm
by Lokasenna
I wonder if we could/should create a wiki...
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 2:40 pm
by witpqs
ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
I wonder if we could/should create a wiki...
Come to think of it there is a wiki. Some nice articles, but not comprehensive enough to be a substitute for the other sources.
http://witp-ae.wikia.com/wiki/War_in_the_Pacific:_Admiral%27s_Edition_Wiki
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:55 pm
by Jim Stevens
If it was organized to resemble the manual and it's sections and numbering, it could be an online manual...
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:10 pm
by zuluhour
Mandrake stole my manual....
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:05 pm
by Bullwinkle58
ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
I wonder if we could/should create a wiki...
Wikis have been started here, abandoned, lost, server blew up, gnomes ate it . . .
Wikis have died around here IOW.
The main problem with a wiki is anybody can add to it, and based on posts here in the forum roughly half of a wiki will be incorrect. It's just you won't know which half.
A new manual needs to be written by someone who can see the code. And they aren't interested. Nor do I blame them.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:32 pm
by Lokasenna
ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58
ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
I wonder if we could/should create a wiki...
Wikis have been started here, abandoned, lost, server blew up, gnomes ate it . . .
Wikis have died around here IOW.
The main problem with a wiki is anybody can add to it, and based on posts here in the forum roughly half of a wiki will be incorrect. It's just you won't know which half.
A new manual needs to be written by someone who can see the code. And they aren't interested. Nor do I blame them.
I was pretty sure you could set editing privileges to certain users only. It would clearly have to be a group effort in terms of knowledge contribution, but perhaps aggregating the various resource threads into a wiki-like format wouldn't be so terrible...
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 3:01 pm
by Jim Stevens
What If - What if the wiki was under the control of one editor who was just the mechanic and that person built a new revision section by section with the input and consent of the masses here in the forum. So they would take a section and post it for any proposed revisions or enhancements, get consensus of the forum on any changes and move on to the next section. Now it wouldn't have to be so liner in that several section may be up for revisions depending on how froggy the editor felt.
I think it would sow together a lot of the disjointed data found here in the forum. What do you all think?
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 3:59 pm
by Schanilec
I think we have a volunteer.[;)]
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 1:23 am
by Lokasenna
ORIGINAL: Schanilec
I think we have a volunteer.[;)]
I'd commit to it if I thought I had the time [:(]. Maybe in 4 months.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:53 pm
by Jim Stevens
ORIGINAL: Schanilec
I think we have a volunteer.[;)]
I do volunteer. And I think I have the qualifications:
1) Long standing interest and experience in wargaming
2) An fascination with War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition
3) A desire to help the player community
4) 20+ years of Software Engineer experience
5) Virtually a new player perspective
So having presented my qualifications I would like to nominate myself for Editor of this project. My intention is this will be a on-going process over quite some time whereby a chuck at a time I will:
- present the section/chunk/blob of the current manual in the forum
- seek inputs here in the forum
- pull together all inputs and present the proposed in the forum for a vote
- keep refining until consensus is gained
- move on to the next section/chunk/blob
The size of what we consider each cycle will be determined by experience as we go through the process. I don't want to bog down anybody by presenting 10 pages of text to review or wear them out going paragraph by paragraph either.
Now if we have a consensus on the need for the project and acceptance of myself as the editor, the project will need certain items to get started. Specifically:
- permission from the copywrite holder to extend their work so the project is not viewed as a challange to the copywrite
- a wiki host that won't go away
- a copy of the manual to be used as a starting point
- consensus of what format (pdf, text only, docx, etc) the revised manual will be produced in
Now for our first consensus test. What do you all think?
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:07 pm
by Jim Stevens
ORIGINAL: Jim Stevens
ORIGINAL: Schanilec
I think we have a volunteer.[;)]
I do volunteer. And I think I have the qualifications:
1) Long standing interest and experience in wargaming
2) An fascination with War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition
3) A desire to help the player community
4) 20+ years of Software Engineer experience
5) Virtually a new player perspective
So having presented my qualifications I would like to nominate myself for Editor of this project. My intention is this will be a on-going process over quite some time whereby a chuck at a time I will:
- present the section/chunk/blob of the current manual in the forum
- seek inputs here in the forum
- pull together all inputs and present the proposed in the forum for a vote
- keep refining until consensus is gained
- move on to the next section/chunk/blob
The size of what we consider each cycle will be determined by experience as we go through the process. I don't want to bog down anybody by presenting 10 pages of text to review or wear them out going paragraph by paragraph either.
Now if we have a consensus on the need for the project and acceptance of myself as the editor, the project will need certain items to get started. Specifically:
- permission from the copywrite holder to extend their work so the project is not viewed as a challange to the copywrite
- a wiki host that won't go away
- a copy of the manual to be used as a starting point
- consensus of what format (pdf, text only, docx, etc) the revised manual will be produced in
Now for our first consensus test. What do you all think?
Well that went over like flatulence in a place of worship...
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:38 pm
by USSAmerica
.... and that's the biggest problem with getting a "proper" wiki off the ground and updated to a useful state. You need to find the right people with both the knowledge and the time. I wish you luck! I'd love to have a useful wiki available. [:)]
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:00 pm
by Jim Stevens
So far you are the only person to express support for the adventure. Why do you think nobody else even comments on the proposal? I thought I would get some support expressed?
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:36 pm
by USSAmerica
Sadly, Jim, because we've seen this attempted and started at least 3 times before this one.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:43 pm
by thegreatwent
A wiki would be useful but drumming up support from people who have the time and expertise will probably be the biggest stumbling block. I don't feel qualified and I've been playing since the game was released.
RE: Where's the beef?
Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:14 pm
by Lokasenna
ORIGINAL: thegreatwent
A wiki would be useful but drumming up support from people who have the time and expertise will probably be the biggest stumbling block. I don't feel qualified and I've been playing since the game was released.
I wish I had the time. Just took on a bunch more at work (essentially working two positions now), which is great and all for my career but the hobby/game time is really suffering. I think I could do a quick-and-dirty version that basically just pulled a bunch of forum posts and resources (edited for formatting and language consistency), but I get the feeling it wouldn't be all that quick (probably 20-30 hours of effort...) and very dirty. But at least it would be a start...?
It sounds like Jim Stevens has something cooking already, though?