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Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 1:15 am
by Dili
Maybe too big and the plane was the B5N?
Wondering what was the typical aircraft complement when they were escorting convoys.
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 1:33 am
by PaxMondo
To my knowledge, the Val was smaller and easier to launch as compared to the Kate. If they could handle a Kate, then the Val should have been easier. I think most of the CVE's and CVL's shipped Kates if they could because the Kate was more versatile and had better range. This is all conjectured opinion from my readings.
I'll be interested to hear from better authorities on this ...
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 1:50 am
by Dili
I remember while ago to read that Val could not get into some elevators. But maybe a smallish deck park was possible but that was not Japanese practice.
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 2:48 am
by tigercub
The kate was bigger and harder to launch needed longer deck and there was not that many of them available production was stopped at the start of the war(crazy) the thinking was the jill would be ready soon...lol production was started again with only a hand full available...after midway not many CVs anyway...as to the Vals and CVEs at least early in the war there the only plane in any number available planes for them.
Tigercub
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 5:58 am
by wdolson
The Val had fixed wings and the Kate had folding wings. The Val probably couldn't fit on the elevators.
Bill
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 8:12 am
by Gilbert
ORIGINAL: wdolson
The Val had fixed wings and the Kate had folding wings. The Val probably couldn't fit on the elevators.
Bill
In fact, the D3A1s had folded wing tips. With their wings/wingtips folded, IJN carrier a/c had the following dimensions (span x length x height): A6M2 – 10,955x9,05x3,525 m; D3A1 – 10,932x10,185x3,348 m; B5N2 – 7,5x10,3x3,7.
As you can see, A6M2 and D3A1 dimensions are close. The CVE's used the former but never the latter due to operational considerations. In fact, the IJN never operated dive-bombers, either the D3A or the D4Y from their CVEs or CVLs - I don't think they were stupid, so there had to be a good reason. While a significant part was surely the fact that attack aircraft could carry larger and more varied bomb loads as well as a trained observer, there were just as clearly some operational considerations.
CVEs were mostly used either to escort convoys or to ferry aircraft in transport missions. You don't need dive-bombers for that but versatile aircraft able to perform ASW missions and the B5Ns were more suitable for that role.
Gilbert
RE: Could Jap CVE's employ Aichi Val?
Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 12:55 pm
by Lokasenna
ORIGINAL: Gilbert
ORIGINAL: wdolson
The Val had fixed wings and the Kate had folding wings. The Val probably couldn't fit on the elevators.
Bill
In fact, the D3A1s had folded wing tips. With their wings/wingtips folded, IJN carrier a/c had the following dimensions (span x length x height): A6M2 – 10,955x9,05x3,525 m; D3A1 – 10,932x10,185x3,348 m; B5N2 – 7,5x10,3x3,7.
As you can see, A6M2 and D3A1 dimensions are close. The CVE's used the former but never the latter due to operational considerations. In fact, the IJN never operated dive-bombers, either the D3A or the D4Y from their CVEs or CVLs - I don't think they were stupid, so there had to be a good reason. While a significant part was surely the fact that attack aircraft could carry larger and more varied bomb loads as well as a trained observer, there were just as clearly some operational considerations.
CVEs were mostly used either to escort convoys or to ferry aircraft in transport missions. You don't need dive-bombers for that but versatile aircraft able to perform ASW missions and the B5Ns were more suitable for that role.
Gilbert
+1. Even if the D4Y had been around and capable of launching off the CVEs/CVLs, I'd still prefer the B5N (and B6N). CVEs/CVLs are good auxiliary and utility platforms, and the torpedo planes filled that role best.