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never had one of these and having trouble which to buy? Pride of nations? or Civil war 2? I love the more global scale of pride of nations but with just don't know

Check the thread on Pride there were claims it processes the turn slow.

ORIGINAL: Titan

never had one of these and having trouble which to buy? Pride of nations? or Civil war 2? I love the more global scale of pride of nations but with just don't know

PoN is very different. Its akin to nation building in the 19C where trade, industry and constructing a colonial empire trumps mere warfare. Which is, of course not to say there are not plenty of wars.

Key to the game is that its very hard, within Europe, for any nation to expand out of its historical borders. Of course, to spice things up, there are plenty of contested regions, but the grand map of Europe in 1920 will look something like it did in 1850 (possibly with new nations having appeared).

Its a gem, the battle scenarios are good and cover rarely covered campaigns such as the Franco-Prussian or Russo-Japanese Wars.

As does ACW2 it models asymetric warfare very well, colonial campaigns become a matter of light armed brigades trying to track down the locals, if you send in the regulars they risk falling apart due to cohesion and supply. But you often need regular units to crack a particular problem - so lots of small scale dilemnas and decision making.

The economic model is good, there is a very real feeling that the economy has a natural limit but that you need to trade with and support the rest of the world. A key mindset is todays enemy is tomorrows trading partner.

Yep turn processing is a problem. Depends on your computer but in early years I get 2-3 mins, I'm up to 1900 in my AAR and I reckon 6-7 mins per turn. You end up working around this, there is no need to watch the bulk of the processing closely so it becomes a game you can progress while some of your attention is elsewhere.

Again loki100 you input is valued...Thanks for your thoughts sounds like you are having a blast with this, Civil war2 just seems like a smaller playing field I do like the big picture stuff

ORIGINAL: Titan

Again loki100 you input is valued...Thanks for your thoughts sounds like you are having a blast with this, Civil war2 just seems like a smaller playing field I do like the big picture stuff

The bulk of the AGEOD games (Rise of Prussia, Revolution Under Siege, ACW et al) are superb in-depth simulations of a particular war or campaign. PoN is an utterly different beast.

If you've never used the AGE system I'd suggest learning either with one of their 'easier' games - Wars In America is ideal as it has limited troop numbers (except in the American Revolution scenarios) and simple rules for command (ie fill up a stack with units till you have no spare command points). If you start with PoN, play the battle scenarios first. They are good games in their own right but also help you understand things like stance/commitment, march to the sound of the guns and other key concepts common across their games.

If not, you run the risk of losing an army that took you 10 years to build in your first war due to an oversight. The AI is quite capable of handing you a beating as it is - without giving it a helping hand [8D]

I do not have ACW2 so I can only agree with loki's comments about PoN. You really feel like a leader of your country in PoN. Even more so than in EU 3 or 4 Mainly because a lot of things in PoN are outside of your direct control. So you must set things up that you do have direct control over like, trade and tarrifs, that will improve your overall econemy and militay power.

While the turn processing is not fast (mine takes about 5 mins), I agree it is not that big of a deal as it allows me to do other things whih actually helps me with my 'to do list' [:)]. As everything you need to know is in the turn log that you can review at the start of each turn, you will not miss anything by doing other things during the turn.

Now if they could just make a PoN 2, I would be estastic [:)]

To make it short:
I am convinced, Pride of Nations is not a good recommendation for AGEOD system beginners.

5 minutes is not slow, try playing ATG with 4 AI opponents on a huge map, I wait up to 30 minutes at times )

I started with PoN and was really confused. But bought CW2 and like so much and just went all in with Espana, BOA2(of course Sunday and paid $10 more-D'OH) and Napoleon's Campaigns. Sure which they had a value pack- lol. Anyway with winter coming, I think I will be covered gaming for awhile, may even give PoN another try.