Matrix Games Forums

Has anyone tried attaching divisional or brigade artillery units to maneuver battalions for an attack?
In other words, select a btn HQ, and then select one or two artillery units for the same attack, so they are subordinate to the attacking battalion.
Check the "artillery direct support" box for the attack. Won't the divisional/brigade artillery units be
on call for support of that attack, and dedicated exclusively to that attack only?

ORIGINAL: keoman

Has anyone tried attaching divisional or brigade artillery units to maneuver battalions for an attack?

Regularly. Doing so makes those artillery assets more responsive to the subordinates of the battalion.

ORIGINAL: keoman
In other words, select a btn HQ, and then select one or two artillery units for the same attack, so they are subordinate to the attacking battalion.
Check the "artillery direct support" box for the attack. Won't the divisional/brigade artillery units be
on call for support of that attack, and dedicated exclusively to that attack only?

They should - this basically means they'll be ignoring artillery support requests being routed through the higher echelon of their organic chain of command.

There are still a few issues with it though, and some limitations you need to be aware of.

See here for more info:

tm.asp?m=3286717

Werfer units are treated as mortars instead of raged artillery, and made to move to the Reserve location.
It has a strange effect on the formation of your attack, thinking it is bigger than it actually is.

This was in effect for the patch before the latest one.
I have not done any testing to see if things have changed for the latest patch.

One drawback. I attached a divisional artillery battery to a battalion attack. The artillery battery was
about 7 or 8 kilometers behind the battalion HQ. The artillery relocated forward so that the FUP of
the attack was just outside of its minimum range limit. So the battery was out of commission for an hour
or so while it repositioned. Still a good tactic, though. Thanks for the feedback.

Talking about this with another player, I'm of the opinion that manual micro of artillery is a gamey tactic since the AI is not capable of this. Anyone agree? I'd much prefer rearranging the OOB and using the OP's idea of checking "artillery direct support".

Have anyone else sunk as low as using echelon formation while moving along the edge of a map?

I have talked to someone about this before with regard to using artillery during Multi player matches.

The AI won't do a pre-bombardment of an objective for you, which is one of the major roles for artillery.

I think this was left out intentionally (Would need Dave to confirm that), in order to give the player something to do.
If you watch the tutorial videos, number 5 and 6 I think, you will see Dave give the orders to the Brigade artillery to do this.

If you have an artillery heavy force like the Axis in the Hofen scenario for example, and don't utilise this, then the player taking on the role of Axis is at a huge disadvantage compared to the player playing Allies, that has a small artillery component but a large armoured one during this battle.

Like wise I am sure for other scenarios where the artillery elements are not exactly matched.

In a single player scenario of course you can micro as much as you like.
The enemy AI will in my experience, do a pre bombardment of your positions before an assault, and I have had so many infantry units caught out in the open during my learning curve for this game, and decimated in an hour or more long bombardment, to feel any remorse or shame in doing the same [:'(]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_U_aZkmSh7g

Go to 02:30

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHJ4LBn5WiY

Go to 03:15

Original - dazkaz15
In a single player scenario of course you can micro as much as you like.
The enemy AI will in my experience, do a pre bombardment of your positions before an assault, and I have had so many infantry units caught out in the open during my learning curve for this game, and decimated in an hour or more long bombardment, to feel any remorse or shame in doing the same

As a newbie I have used pre bombardments of about 15-25 mins. Is an hour bombardment effective against the AI? What would artillery doctrine be for pre-bombardments in WW2?

Well at the very start of the Scenario for the first day of the Ardennes offensive your artillery will start with no ammunition.
This was because historically the Axis did an hour long bombardment of the Allied lines.
This was largely ineffective, partly because the Allies were in very well prepared positions.
Partly because they were not registered during daylight beforehand onto targets they had reconnoitred due to the secrecy of the attack, and partly because they never followed closely with the infantry assault (they left it to long from the bombardment finishing, to the assault reaching the Allied positions)

The Allies on the other hand completely decimated the Axis infantry, and soft skin vehicles at Butgenbach, with their Artillery, which arguably swung the battle for the Allies on the Northern Shoulder of the Offensive.

As a general rule I usually stop the game when the assault is underway, and about 500m away from the first likely enemy position. This gives about 15 min of pre bombardment for an infantry assault.
This seems to be a good compromise between ammo expenditure, and enemy suppression.

Some might think this is too long, but it seems to work for me at any rate.

From the wiki article:
On 16 December 1944, at 5:30 am, the Germans began the assault with a massive, 90-minute artillery barrage using 1,600 artillery pieces across an 80 miles (130 km) front on the Allied troops facing the 6th Panzer Army.

December 22 saw the last attack on the right of Elsenborn ridge; this was also smothered by heavy American artillery fire, which fired 10,000 rounds in one day

ORIGINAL: dazkaz15
The AI won't do a pre-bombardment of an objective for you, which is one of the major roles for artillery.

I think this was left out intentionally (Would need Dave to confirm that), in order to give the player something to do.

That's a current limitation of AI planning algorithms: they can't develop fire plans. It's on our TODO list [:)]