Matrix Games Forums

Been playing the Maria and Victoria scenario. After a couple of times through I was able to get an "Average" score...then quit for now.

Where might I find more detailed information regarding submarine tactics, specifically with regard to the use of diesel subs? Thanx for your help.

Have not played this scenario yet but as a rule these are good Sub tactics.

Slow is silent, creep / loiter is best when patrolling. If you start cavitating in an enemy detection range, your going die.
Do not transmit sonar or radar, ever. Unless it is to confirm a target before firing.
You are at your most vunerable when your about to fire.
After launching torpedoes or missiles, immediately fast and deep. This is called clearing the datum.
Changing depth can help with avoiding counter-detection. If you can stay below a layer this can hide you from enemy transmissions. Also, if your ASW, above the layer can hide you from enemy subs who are deeper than you are.

I don't know how accurately sonar transmissions are modelled yet but there are basically 2 types, CW and FM, each have different evasion tactics. will have to trial it out to see if this game accurately models them.

Remember 3 basic rules for all real life submariners:

Remain Safe
Avoid Counter-Detection
Achieve the Aim

Thanx for your help. I'll keep those tactics in mind. Its harder than I thought.

Well this time I successfully destroyed the MineSweeper. ...only to be beat down by the Frigates.

Back to the drawing board. [;)][;)][;)]

That is great info. That brings a question for me.

What about the sprint and drift maneuver? In the game, I sprint half the distance of the first convergence zone and then creep for about 3 or 4 miles. Stopping once or twice and changing depths and course. Then I sprint again. That seams to work here but how is it really done on a 688? I searched the web and can not find anything. I think you would sprint to the edge of your hull sensors, stop, listen and sprint again. Just a guess.

Well, I finally was able to sink the landing ships and minesweeper while being able to avoid the frigates. Great learning experience. Thanx for your help.

I couldn't find much info on "tactics" either.

Not so sure it completely answers the question, but in terms of tactics most individuals differ on this one.
Diesel subs are actually pretty awkward, they are admittedly very quiet, but don't honestly move far or fast.
That said in littoral conditions they are extremely difficult to detect and you should get the first shot off.

I think overall for subs, you need to know the odd occasions when you can use the periscope, with nukes this works well, as you can take a look, get an idea where MPA patrols are then leg it.
Same for torpedo attacks,, once you fire that's almost certain to be a detection, so need to go deep and fast as soon as possible. Worth sometimes firing off several BOL attacks as well as your main attack on HVU just to keep the defence occupied. If you are lucky, you'll get in repeat attacks, just wouldn't count on it.

If you have a towed array these are a big plus, but you need CZ depth of water (about 200 m plus) to get the most out of it, and you need to search the layers. You also need to change heading so that you search around you. In effect if headed straight at a contact you aren't searching necessarily as well, as if you are parallel to it (or its on your rear aspect).

Subs are also reasonable recon assets for checking on land formations, or a landing zone, the scope again is useful here.

Varying the depth is critical, at deep you aren't easily picked up by much, even at a reasonable speed. At creep a search needs to include the different layers again. Rather than use say creep then a sprint of 20 knots or so, personally I tend to use all creep if I can, or a slower cruise of say 11 knots etc. That's often sufficient for an interception of a surface unit while still reasonably quiet. If you sprint into a surface formation at high speed, they are bound to detect you. Pushing for a long range shot at speed is a good way to lose a sub for no return.

Good stuff here.... Since Harpoon classic on AOL I have had the most trouble getting good use out of subs. Of course, some questions for any/all with the info to help.

1. Now, If I have read correctly, those thick light green concentric rings are the CZ zones. This where I will detect an enemy sub, not closer or farther?!?

2. Since ships don't perform sprint/drift when part of a larger, non ASW patrol convoy, should I separate them and micro-manage the waypoints, speed, to have them perform better? I know it's planned for future updates, but as it is now I had a sub pop up next to a burke the other day and smash it before I even know what was going on, lol.

3. Sub vs. Sub combat - this is my worst area by far. There is a lot of micro managing going on to constantly change layers, speeds. In small scenarios it's not that bad, but in multi fleet engagements, I rarely, rarely, rarely kill enemy subs with my one.

This is all for now, after 14 years of failed experiments, one thing I know is that on this particular topic, the less info at a time to digest the better. Thank god ASW aircraft/helos/and ships were developed, or I would have zero sub kills over my lifetime, lol.