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Is there any trick to make a naval air attack in a sector, for example using the search sectors to set it?

ORIGINAL: Dili

Is there any trick to make a naval air attack in a sector, for example using the search sectors to set it?

No, unfortunately. The only thing that you can try is to only search where you want to allow attacks, because TFs have to be detected to be attacked. But that only has a partial chance of working out.

As I remember it was particularly tricksy for Japaenese Nells operating out of Indo-China ... although there may be a sweet target down around Singapore or on the west coast of Borneo they would inevitably fly into a swarm of CAP at Rangoon.[:(]

You can use the range, in some case it help like for escort.

If you want to not launch strike be cautious with the leader, high aggression mean he will launch a strike even if there is high CAP. Detection level will help launching a strike or not depending of ennemy CAP and escort.

range and search vectors works good.
no search means no detection = no air strike

Thanks everyone. Unfortunately that doesn't work. There are need of other necessary searches.

Then you have to rebase them so that your target is the closest. Early on, this can be very tricky and a lot of times I have to let Allied TF's escape rather than risk my Netties.

It would be interesting to brainstorm the pros and cons of setting arcs for Nav Attack like the Nav Search option.

You dont have to use it, but if you want to limit where attacks are made, for example to keep away from a heavily defended base it could have uses.

It could also see juicy targets avoided by being 5 degrees outside the zone!

Yes . And of course it can even have a threshold to violate the rule based on squadron leader aggressivity.

I also brought this up a few days ago having got fed up of good unit getting chewed up.

I am having the same problem in the Guadalcanal scenario as the Japanese, with my Betties reacting to detected TFs in Port Moresby, when I want to attack Milne Bay's TFs.

I stood down all 360 degrees searches originating from Rabaul. I confined all my search aircraft to search arcs which do not overfly Port Moresby (the Allied CAP beehive), but my aircraft still detect TFs at Moresby. My Naval Attack Betties have a small percentage (20%) of their aircraft restricted to a very narrow search arc overflying Milne Bay and still some of them give me a "ping" over Port Moresby TFs, which I do not want.

I had to restrict the Betties to range of 9 hexes (just enough to reach Milne Bay) and it works, but coordination with fighters is almost impossible. I just wish the Naval Attack orders had two types: All (base and at sea TFs) and Non-Base (just sea TFs). One unescorted Betty raid reacting to a base with some weak CAP and you lose 5-6 very good bomber pilots.

ORIGINAL: Dili

Is there any trick to make a naval air attack in a sector, for example using the search sectors to set it?

be aware that not only nav search is spotting enemy shipping. Also subs for example or if an enemy task force enters one of your base hexes. If I want to go after a certain target like an invasion for example I deliberately stand down all my search so hopefully nothing but the ships in the base hex are spotted. Also to add in the fact that far more bombers usually attack convoys in base hexes than they manage to get to a TF at Sea.

ORIGINAL: castor troy

ORIGINAL: Dili

Is there any trick to make a naval air attack in a sector, for example using the search sectors to set it?

be aware that not only nav search is spotting enemy shipping. Also subs for example or if an enemy task force enters one of your base hexes. If I want to go after a certain target like an invasion for example I deliberately stand down all my search so hopefully nothing but the ships in the base hex are spotted. Also to add in the fact that far more bombers usually attack convoys in base hexes than they manage to get to a TF at Sea.

How do you figure?

Maybe it's just a function of DL, with the DL on a TF in a base hex typically being higher due to recon planes, etc...

ORIGINAL: Yaab

I am having the same problem in the Guadalcanal scenario as the Japanese, with my Betties reacting to detected TFs in Port Moresby, when I want to attack Milne Bay's TFs.

I stood down all 360 degrees searches originating from Rabaul. I confined all my search aircraft to search arcs which do not overfly Port Moresby (the Allied CAP beehive), but my aircraft still detect TFs at Moresby. My Naval Attack Betties have a small percentage (20%) of their aircraft restricted to a very narrow search arc overflying Milne Bay and still some of them give me a "ping" over Port Moresby TFs, which I do not want.

I had to restrict the Betties to range of 9 hexes (just enough to reach Milne Bay) and it works, but coordination with fighters is almost impossible. I just wish the Naval Attack orders had two types: All (base and at sea TFs) and Non-Base (just sea TFs). One unescorted Betty raid reacting to a base with some weak CAP and you lose 5-6 very good bomber pilots.

Of course nothing like that ever happened in the real war [:)]

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: castor troy
far more bombers usually attack convoys in base hexes than they manage to get to a TF at Sea.

How do you figure?

Maybe it's just a function of DL, with the DL on a TF in a base hex typically being higher due to recon planes, etc...

You are correct.

There are more triggers to increase DL in a base hex than in an open sea hex. The most common would be, as you already mentioned, recon, but also regular base strikes or any ground unit located there. In addition TF actions like changing TF orders/unloading/changing TF composition/departing and so on, has chances to generate radio traffic, which also increases DL.

The higher the DL of a TF the higher the chance of a squadron assigned to naval strike against it, and the higher the chance of other squadrons joining in.

No magic behind this one. [;)]

Two additional factors I forgot, which also increase the probability of TFs to be attacked in port:

Coast watchers (thats a classic, often wanted information, but in the context of the OP´s question, unwanted)

And - as much related to DL as to simple probability - there is a higher chance for any TF to be located at a base hex at time of detection than in any distinct open water hex, for obvious reasons: Ports are regular required TF destinations, as compared to a random open water location, remain there for longer, and so increase statistical chance of detection and accumulated DL.

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

ORIGINAL: castor troy

ORIGINAL: Dili

Is there any trick to make a naval air attack in a sector, for example using the search sectors to set it?

be aware that not only nav search is spotting enemy shipping. Also subs for example or if an enemy task force enters one of your base hexes. If I want to go after a certain target like an invasion for example I deliberately stand down all my search so hopefully nothing but the ships in the base hex are spotted. Also to add in the fact that far more bombers usually attack convoys in base hexes than they manage to get to a TF at Sea.

How do you figure?

Maybe it's just a function of DL, with the DL on a TF in a base hex typically being higher due to recon planes, etc...

Because air strikes have an easier time finding a base than a TF on open sea which is quite realistic too I guess. Has always been like this and yes, that is something I tested long ago to confirm my gut feeling. That has brought me to the point when I stood down all my nav search and my bombers only attacked shipping in the invasion hex and just ignored the carriers next door (if not spotted by a sub for example). Even if a TF has max DL you will on average see more bombers actually attacking it when it is at a base than on open sea. You will see less "bombers lose cohesion" "bombers fail to find target" and the like and finally more bombers over the target.

As to the recon, I can't recon my own base and I was talking about enemy task forces in my base hexes. Can't say what those TFs got in terms of DL from being in the base hex because I can't see the DL before the attack. After the attack it is 10/10 anyways. On average always more bombers over a TF with full detection in a base than on open sea when also having full detection. Don't ask me why, I don't know.

4 out of 5 times people complain about their bombers not attacking or not finding an enemy task force at sea that had full DL. How many times ppl complain about their bombers not going after a base? Must be a correlation there.

This whole set-up somewhat nullifies the advantages of range enjoyed by Betties and Nells.

Imagine a 22 hex axis called SOUTH:

0 hex: Japanese base 1 with Betties set to Naval Attack, range 22 hexes. It is the only base Japs have
7 hex: Allied base A with CAP
25 hex: Allied base B with CAP, from which ships move supply/fuel/troops to base A


Because TFs between hexes 7-25 are constantly moving, it is hard to keep DL on them and find them during attack. Any TF unloading at base A will produce high DL and will get attacked 90% of the time.

Basically, all the Allies need to do is to make sure Japs cannot perform air attacks from bases perpendicular to axis SOUTH, and they are guaranteed the Betties will react to TFs in base A. With correct approach lines, the TFs at sea will be immune from naval attacks by Japanese land base bombers from base 1.

And, since most Naval Attack group react into bases anyway, then wouldn't it be nice to give the air groups destination, just like in Recon/Ground/Port/City attack? You would have a free-wheeling Naval Attack and Naval Attack with destination.

IIRC naval attack arcs were considered during a developement phase - as for NvS/ASW - but dumped for a number of reasons (technical as well as from a gameplay perspective).

Personally I don´t think destination setting would work. The advantage of naval attack is precisely that it enables you to strike at a target unknown at the time the mission is set. Any limitation to this ability deprives naval attack of its´ premier advantage. In 99% of the cases specific situations can be avoided with range and/or search arc setting.

As far as your example goes: Simply do not attack, or attack and risk a turkey shoot, or time your attack precisely to TF positions.