Matrix Games Forums

After toying with Husky and Battlegrond Italy I am turning my attention to the air campaign in the North. Playing the introductory air scenario I just feel I am randomly changing parameters (target types, area of directives, altitude, etc.) with no clue what I am doing. My instincts from decades of playing ground wargames are useless. Can anyone provide tips as to how to play the Allied strategic air well?

Great question. I am struggling with this too. It's a great idea to play that intro air scenario, but you're right, it doesn't really create a framework for which targets to attack. Just make sure you're targeting stuff that counts for VPs in that scenario.

Once you fire up the grand campaign, you'll see that the campaign victory conditions, and the long-term nature of the game, do shape your choices more. In 1943 only, for example, you can save a few VPs a turn if you shut down a large number of U-Boat factories -- but that benefit expires at the end of 1943, and it offers no direct long-term benefit to your land fighting forces. (See p. 209 of the manual for details.) In my current game, I'm losing 4 U-Boat VPs a turn even though I've shut down a number of U-Boat factories, and I'm debating whether to step up the campaign or abandon it. If you want to do it, you have to really go all in; if not, you choose a different target.

Likewise, in 1944 and 1945, you can save a few VPs a turn if you bomb V-1 and V-2 factories. This saves you some VPs but doesn't directly damage the Axis ground forces. Again, it only seems worth doing if you really go for it.

Beyond that, there are VP limits that you're probably familiar with -- only German-nationality Heavy Industry and Manpower count, whereas any Oil, Fuel or Synth Fuel counts. Here, your choices might be shaped by whether you want to interfere with supply/armaments/aircraft production (HI) or soldier replacements (Manpower) or oil-related stuff (effectiveness of AFVs and aircraft, I imagine). Also, your choices are shaped by the deployment of enemy flak.

Anyway, those are some of my initial thoughts. I'm only a few turns into my grand campaign, so I'm hardly an expert. I hope some of the devs and beta-testers will weigh in.

ORIGINAL: Grotius
Beyond that, there are VP limits that you're probably familiar with -- only German-nationality Heavy Industry and Manpower count, whereas any Oil, Fuel or Synth Fuel counts. Here, your choices might be shaped by whether you want to interfere with supply/armaments/aircraft production (HI) or soldier replacements (Manpower) or oil-related stuff (effectiveness of AFVs and aircraft, I imagine). Also, your choices are shaped by the deployment of enemy flak.

Anyway, those are some of my initial thoughts. I'm only a few turns into my grand campaign, so I'm hardly an expert. I hope some of the devs and beta-testers will weigh in.

There are many factors to consider.

You need to monitor your casualties and plan accordingly as decisions what Germany makes also impact what allied do with strategic bombing. For example if Germany player decides to protect fuel industry with every interceptor, flak and construction units it is just nuts keep bombing fuel industry when same time for example rail yards in France and Italy are totally unprotected.

This is reason why you cannot say one strategy fits every situation. How germany uses interceptors, flak and construction units also impact decision making.

ORIGINAL: Jakerson

ORIGINAL: Grotius
Beyond that, there are VP limits that you're probably familiar with -- only German-nationality Heavy Industry and Manpower count, whereas any Oil, Fuel or Synth Fuel counts. Here, your choices might be shaped by whether you want to interfere with supply/armaments/aircraft production (HI) or soldier replacements (Manpower) or oil-related stuff (effectiveness of AFVs and aircraft, I imagine). Also, your choices are shaped by the deployment of enemy flak.

Anyway, those are some of my initial thoughts. I'm only a few turns into my grand campaign, so I'm hardly an expert. I hope some of the devs and beta-testers will weigh in.

There are many factors to consider.

You need to monitor your casualties and plan accordingly as decisions what Germany makes also impact what allied do with strategic bombing. For example if Germany player decides to protect fuel industry with every interceptor, flak and construction units it is just nuts keep bombing fuel industry when same time for example rail yards in France and Italy are totally unprotected.

This is reason why you cannot say one strategy fits every situation. How germany uses interceptors, flak and construction units also impact decision making.

How do I know if there are many flaks at a certain place? And how do I know if the enemy has chosen to set air superiority to high in that area?

To spot the flak -> shift-O.

To spot the interceptors -> well that's more tricky because they can move. But if every sortie in the same zone takes losses from air combat, you know there are interceptors there.

Is there a discrete list of VPs and how and why they are lost? I am rather confused and bemused by the VP counter....

For example, Is there a way to know how much each city is worth? Is a city worth points per turn held or one time liberation? How much are losses for casualties? etc..etc.. Sorry, I havent read the manual, just looking to be pointed to a list of the VP calculator

The whole chapter 25 of the manual explains victory conditions and VP's. It is very complete and talks about every case (there are different rules for the campaigns, the scenarios and the air tutorial).

As per the manual, in the full 43-45 campaign you have 3 separate VP counters tied to the allied Strat bombing:
1) Axis industry
2) U-boat factories
3) V-bomb sites

Point 2) and 3) are tied to the date your in.
On 43, the game keeps track of how many u-boat factories there are, and how much you damage, and gives you a VP penalty for the amount of u-boat factories not damaged at the end of each turn. Meaning, if you bomb 100% of the u-boat factories, you get a 0 penalty per turn.

On 44 and 45, the game STOPS keeping track of u-boat factories, and starts keeping track of V-bomb sites and factories, using the same system as per the u-boats.

Point 1 is a bit more tricky.
The axis industry is divided in 5 categories:
1)German Manpower
2)German Heavy Industry
3)Axis Oil Factories
4)Axis Fuel Factories
5)Axis Synthetic Fuel Factories

So, bombing, per example, a french armaments factory nets you absolutely 0 VPs.

Now, onto more detail. There are a total of 8202 factories that go into those last 5 categories.
1)German Manpower - 5973 points, totaling 72.8%
2)German Heavy Industry - 1392 points, totaling 17%
3)Axis Oil Factories - 260 points, totaling 3.2%
4)Axis Fuel Factories - 332 points, totaling 4%
5)Axis Synthetic Fuel Factories - 245 points, totaling 3%

With these numbers, you can see that german manpower centers should be a priority from a VP point of view, but there are a few other options that i would like to point out:


As you can see, the Hamburg region is an extremely rich target for 43 bombing.
1st, you have 77% of the u-boat factories in the vicinity (red targets), plus, near 20% of all the oil and fuel production for the axis. 20% oil and fuel means 1.44% of the total possible strat bombing targets, just for a 1 hex radius region around Hamburg. Either you play allies or axis, this is definitely an area you want to strat bomb\defend.

Next, the holy Grail of the Axis oil production, the area near Bucharest (check the minimap if your lost)


52% of all the oil production, plus 25% of fuel production. you will need mainland italy airbases to hit these fields, but once you do, you have access to a full 2.66% of the total possible strat bombing targets, plus a big hit to oil production.

Finaly, let me mention this area:

Its near Breslau, meaning deep into polish territory, but in just 2 hexes you have 25% of all the Synthetic fuel production for the Axis, meaning 1.5% of total strat VP points. Worth the shot if you B17 bombers can reach them

As for the German Heavy factories and Manpower centers, the high concentration spots should be easy to pick, and the AI does a good job at it (just set your priorities via Air directive screen). Hope this helps.

Most of UBOOTS production can be damaged quick. And the Ruhr is close with a lot of nice targets.

The aircraft industry requires flying deep. Produces a lot of moans in preflight briefings.

As Allies I always have railyards on highest priority and then rotate the others up and down the priority chain. Run the same targets for a few weeks. Or keep same target area and just change priorities.

I figure damaged railyards will weaken all the others.

Fly your forts high.
Strategic recon target first. Watch your camera loadout... high for high, low for low.

Watch your aircraft replacement. Don't want to be flying P40s while P51s sit on the grass.

Thanks, jajusha, this is incredibly helpful. One small question, when setting target priorities, I only see Oil as an option. Will the system automatically bomb all oil, fuel and synthetic in the target area?

You should see both Oil and Fuel as a target in the "Target Priority" menu. "Fuel" targets both types of fuel, synthetic and regular fuel, unless I'm mistaken. If you target only Oil, I'm not sure you'll hit Fuel too; I target both.

This is great stuff-- more please!

(I need all the help I can get in the air war...)

ORIGINAL: jnpoint

ORIGINAL: Jakerson

ORIGINAL: Grotius
Beyond that, there are VP limits that you're probably familiar with -- only German-nationality Heavy Industry and Manpower count, whereas any Oil, Fuel or Synth Fuel counts. Here, your choices might be shaped by whether you want to interfere with supply/armaments/aircraft production (HI) or soldier replacements (Manpower) or oil-related stuff (effectiveness of AFVs and aircraft, I imagine). Also, your choices are shaped by the deployment of enemy flak.

Anyway, those are some of my initial thoughts. I'm only a few turns into my grand campaign, so I'm hardly an expert. I hope some of the devs and beta-testers will weigh in.

There are many factors to consider.

You need to monitor your casualties and plan accordingly as decisions what Germany makes also impact what allied do with strategic bombing. For example if Germany player decides to protect fuel industry with every interceptor, flak and construction units it is just nuts keep bombing fuel industry when same time for example rail yards in France and Italy are totally unprotected.

This is reason why you cannot say one strategy fits every situation. How germany uses interceptors, flak and construction units also impact decision making.

How do I know if there are many flaks at a certain place? And how do I know if the enemy has chosen to set air superiority to high in that area?

Hit shift-O once to see flak in cities. Hit shift-O a second time to see ground-unit flak.
Cary

ORIGINAL: cfulbright

ORIGINAL: jnpoint

ORIGINAL: Jakerson



There are many factors to consider.

You need to monitor your casualties and plan accordingly as decisions what Germany makes also impact what allied do with strategic bombing. For example if Germany player decides to protect fuel industry with every interceptor, flak and construction units it is just nuts keep bombing fuel industry when same time for example rail yards in France and Italy are totally unprotected.

This is reason why you cannot say one strategy fits every situation. How germany uses interceptors, flak and construction units also impact decision making.

How do I know if there are many flaks at a certain place? And how do I know if the enemy has chosen to set air superiority to high in that area?

Hit shift-O once to see flak in cities. Hit shift-O a second time to see ground-unit flak.
Cary

WoW so much for FOW- that needs to be changed.

ORIGINAL: Gorforlin

WoW so much for FOW- that needs to be changed.

It only shows you flak values for spotted units.
Cary

ORIGINAL: cfulbright

ORIGINAL: Gorforlin

WoW so much for FOW- that needs to be changed.

It only shows you flak values for spotted units.
Cary

FOW for downed planes, ground CV's ect ect and you know flak values?

Seems a little to Western allied fan boy for me.



FoW for everything other then Flak values?

Totally fair dude?

I can see Pelton on another fling Pigs thread on this.

WTH does he get off his bane? W=When

ORIGINAL: Gorforlin

ORIGINAL: cfulbright

ORIGINAL: Gorforlin

WoW so much for FOW- that needs to be changed.

It only shows you flak values for spotted units.
Cary

FOW for downed planes, ground CV's ect ect and you know flak values?

Seems a little to Western allied fan boy for me.



FoW for everything other then Flak values?

Totally fair dude?

I can see Pelton on another fling Pigs thread on this.

Gorforlin

Gorforlin - maybe you didn't understand me, or I didn't understand you. You only see the flak values for ground units that you've identified. The only way to identify a ground unit is to fly over it (which gives you a pretty good idea of what kind of flak it's throwing up!), or to have your own ground unit adjacent to it (which gives you a pretty good idea of the size and composition of the unit, including flak).

Cary

ORIGINAL: cfulbright

ORIGINAL: Gorforlin

ORIGINAL: cfulbright



It only shows you flak values for spotted units.
Cary

FOW for downed planes, ground CV's ect ect and you know flak values?

Seems a little to Western allied fan boy for me.



FoW for everything other then Flak values?

Totally fair dude?

I can see Pelton on another fling Pigs thread on this.

Gorforlin

Gorforlin - maybe you didn't understand me, or I didn't understand you. You only see the flak values for ground units that you've identified. The only way to identify a ground unit is to fly over it (which gives you a pretty good idea of what kind of flak it's throwing up!), or to have your own ground unit adjacent to it (which gives you a pretty good idea of the size and composition of the unit, including flak).

Cary

Dude division a german is fighting division b allies for MONTHS and we really do not know the CV value as per the combat engine.

You fly over a AA unit and you know the value?

really?

The stupid shift-O thing is 100% a WA fanboy key lol.

How does this help Germany? Not it is a fanboy button.

shift O ok dude all the AA is here her eand here so fly around all the AA?

Does that sound fair?

No as the rest of the game is all about FoW other then the shift-O button.

You don't even know damage to factories, but some how you know where all the AA is and the values?

shift-o = allied fanboy button

Pelton where are you?

Got to go recruit a few more SB people

WANTED DIE OR ALIVE !!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRvCvsRp5ho

Who the heck is Pelton, and why does he keep getting referenced?

I guess you can get a good idea of how many flak guns are around when they start shooting you down =p