Matrix Games Forums

I have watched video about Nicholas "Chieftain's Hatch" Moran explaining and busting tank myths of the Second World War. It raises question: how much are the tanks and weapons in SPWAW modeled according the myths? According the video, 17 Pounder (on Sherman Firefly) should have range only up to 9 hexes (500 yards = 457 meters = 9 hexes; "can't hit broadside of the barn from the inside"), Sherman crews should have good chance of bailing out (hatches right above the seats) etc. Maybe game wasn't designed to model such things in detail. But I just checked encyclopedia, and Tigers seem to have about 50 points more armor at front than what most Shermans do. Compared to what is said in the video, that seems to be little excessive and closer to the (claimed) myth. Has someone in here studied tank diagrams and thus give somewhat reliable input regarding this matter?

From my understanding of things, Matrix tried to use relatively current data, and fit it in as best they could.
As far as the armor ratings, it was kinda tough to accurately model due to the lack of data points covering the armor model. There could probably be a good debate concerning the relative quality of each Nation's armor. AFAIK American and Sov armor was p good, not sure about the Brits but I bet is ranked up there. Germany started out fair to middling, then went downhill fast ...... like everything else haha. The game models this now, but I wonder as to the effect.

However, since the early 2000's a fair bit of new information about WW2 armor has come out of Russia, lot's of which contradicts the "Classic" interpretation of the different weapons platforms.
I know that the historical debate today is really open giving the WW2 German armor a new critical look.


cheers

MM

According the video, 17 Pounder (on Sherman Firefly) should have range only up to 9 hexes (500 yards = 457 meters = 9 hexes; "can't hit broadside of the barn from the inside")

17pdr could take out a Panther at 500m using regular AP ammo. In theory could take out a Panther at 2000 meters using sabot ammo. However in reality poor accuracy beyond 500 meters using sabot ammo.

Nowhere does it say that the gun could only shoot up to 500 meters. They are talking about the practical effective range for taking out a German Panther tank which is said to be 500 meters for the 17pdr using any ammo available. Should also be noted that they are talking about the front armor of a Panther tank.

He's point is that the USA 76mm gun using HVAP ammo was superior to the British 17pdr gun (using sabot) because it could accurately hit up to 1000 meters.

Tigers seem to have about 50 points more armor at front than what most Shermans do. Compared to what is said in the video, that seems to be little excessive and closer to the (claimed) myth.

Not sure if you know this but in the SPWAW Encyclopedia you see the thickness of the armor without the effects of slope added in. However when a round hits the tank the slope is added to the penetration calculations. You can see this if you open the OOB editor. There is the thicknes of the armor and the slope values. At least in the version I have these values are quite close to what they should be.

Also worth noting is that most rounds will hit the tank horizontaly. However if the round hits the sloped armor from a higher ground the sloping is of no use.

Similary although a Tiger tank has flat front armour it is likely not going to be hit head on all the time. If the attacker fires from front-left or front-right the round will hit the Tigers front armour in an angle and increase the effective armor thickness. Even these things are calculated in the game engine. That is something to think about when you wonder why you did not destroy the tank.