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I'm probably gonna get flamed for this but...

I paid my $39 and so far...

I'm wondering what makes TOAW 4 more than just a UI Upgrade with a bunch of new scenarios? Seriously - I wonder.

I really like the new UI. Cleaner, better organized, easier on the eyes. And some of the reports are a bit interesting but if that's all there is - well - $39 IMO is a bit out of line.

Other than the UI I can't tell the difference between 4 and 3 and I've played 3 since almost the 1st day it came out and 2 and 1 before that.

For $39 a major upgrade was expected.

Don't see it - but then I'm not a detail kind'a guy. I see forests not trees. So maybe I'm missing something, or maybe all the major changes are under the hood?

So help me out. What did my $39 get me that wasn't already in 3???

See my first post in this thread:

tm.asp?m=3899655

Well... $39 gets you... 72 cans (12fl.oz) of Milwaukee's Best in WV (at least when I was there), excluding the pills for reducing acid reflux. Now, seriously. The additional features (see Bob's reference) are more than worth it. As for me, I don't care about the UI; I want the inner works (under the hood?!) to be better than those of its predecessor. And they are. If I compare how the AI acted at my Tutorial '41 and now...woooo! The friggin' bugger even gave me a hard time! And I created the scenario to be a... walkover? As for me; I rather skip heartburn after 72 cans of MB's

Klink, Oberst

I have to admit, initially I felt like you. I thought, well it got a face lift but it's still the same old game. But I've noticed several improvement's that make me think it's definitely worth the upgrade.

New supply is awesome, being able to add a alternative icon is super awesome, faster turns, naval warfare, airmobile units no longer get killed by air superiority. Those are just what I've noticed (and important changes for me) I'm sure under the hood there are many changes.

72 cans of Old Mil for $39 - dang... That's a pretty good deal no matter how rot gut that stuff is (more than 6 of those things and my brain makes me pay for putting it thru that hell). Now if I could get 72 bottles of Sam Adams for $39 there'd be a new citizen of WV.

I'll Read the thread Bob Cross reference and see what I've missed.

ORIGINAL: Werewolf13

I'm probably gonna get flamed for this but...

ah hahahaha HaHaHaHa Mwhaahahaha BWHAHAHAHAHAHA

ORIGINAL: Werewolf13

72 cans of Old Mil for $39 - dang... That's a pretty good deal no matter how rot gut that stuff is (more than 6 of those things and my brain makes me pay for putting it thru that hell). Now if I could get 72 bottles of Sam Adams for $39 there'd be a new citizen of WV.

I'll Read the thread Bob Cross reference and see what I've missed.

Booze and fags (cigs for you colonials) really got pricey, even in Berkeley Co. WV. Alas, just down I-81 in VA the lung torpedoes were cheap as chips... as or the booze... nope. I do prefer Sam Adams, Yuengling (see pic) or any other microbrewery when in the US of A.

Klink, Oberst

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

See my first post in this thread:

tm.asp?m=3899655

Very, very informative. Thanks.

FWIW I now think the $39 for TOAW 4 is a very fair price.

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

ORIGINAL: Werewolf13

72 cans of Old Mil for $39 - dang... That's a pretty good deal no matter how rot gut that stuff is (more than 6 of those things and my brain makes me pay for putting it thru that hell). Now if I could get 72 bottles of Sam Adams for $39 there'd be a new citizen of WV.

I'll Read the thread Bob Cross reference and see what I've missed.

Booze and fags (cigs for you colonials) really got pricey, even in Berkeley Co. WV. Alas, just down I-81 in VA the lung torpedoes were cheap as chips... as or the booze... nope. I do prefer Sam Adams, Yuengling (see pic) or any other microbrewery when in the US of A.

Klink, Oberst

Now I am originally a hillbilly (WV) ..... Just how did you pick this locale for a vacations ?

Eastern Panhandle, WV ain't like 'Coal Miner's Daughter' or worse 'Deliverance' style 'bootlegging' or 'Hillbilly' county. Ya's moved to the Hoosiers. Indiana reminds me about... well, I like the ACW history as well... 'Friendly Persuasions'

But aye, got your point. Martinsburg, WV is a dangerous place; crack-heads, meth-zombies... but... with a .22 special in ya'pocket no sweat

Klink, Oberst

Disclaimer: I LOVE WV and the ppl there (where I've been) are awesome. They never kicked my butt, even when I tried to lecture them (the homies at the boozer) about that WE Hessians WERE NOT mercenaries

Klink, Oberst

FWIW I now think the $39 for TOAW 4 is a very fair price.

The Jump Map alone is worth $17.

For $39 I can get 24 of Munich's finest doppelbock, Spaten Optimator. Yummy and a name that kicks ass !

Quitting beer (five a day) and cigs (1/2 pack day) saves me exactly $200 a month in Ohio. More than enough to cover my gaming addiction.

I have very little discipline and never thought I could do it in a million years. But I was helped by a higher power. He said to me, "Just don't think about it." Easiest things I ever did. However, I am now addicted to peanut butter and jelly sandwich!

Essentially the same game, thank goodness, but not. It has plenty more added to it than just UI. Its far better to play older scenarios with than the previous versions.

Curtis Lemay gave you a link that sums it up quite nicely. They have let us know what was in TOAW IV, no secret, can't say you were fooled. Personally, having units revert back to the their previous states after cancelling attacks from planner is a god send. The new naval rules have been needed since, well, forever. And extended supply? Jump map? BTS? It goes on, and these enhancements, as well as the new UI make the asking price well worth it.

I guess you can feel a bit let down for that price, but I don't see it, I think the price is pretty cheap myself, I got more than I expected and happy to pay it. It was well worth it to me, and the game got a whole lot better, without breaking my access to all those previous scenarios. That makes it an outstanding winner to me and the folks who helped deliver TOAW IV should take a bow.

ORIGINAL: gbaby

Personally, having units revert back to the their previous states after cancelling attacks from planner is a god send.

Yeah that's one of those little things that makes your wargaming life a lot better [:D]

ORIGINAL: Oberst_Klink

But aye, got your point. Martinsburg, WV is a dangerous place; crack-heads, meth-zombies... but... with a .22 special in ya'pocket no sweat

Klink, Oberst

.45ACP my man, .45ACP (I'm in OK - not sure but I don't think a 22 is even legal carry though anything bigger all the way up to 45 is. Most here carry 9mm, 40S&W or 45ACP).

ORIGINAL: Werewolf13

I'm probably gonna get flamed for this but...

I paid my $39 and so far...

I'm wondering what makes TOAW 4 more than just a UI Upgrade with a bunch of new scenarios? Seriously - I wonder.

I really like the new UI. Cleaner, better organized, easier on the eyes. And some of the reports are a bit interesting but if that's all there is - well - $39 IMO is a bit out of line.

Other than the UI I can't tell the difference between 4 and 3 and I've played 3 since almost the 1st day it came out and 2 and 1 before that.

For $39 a major upgrade was expected.

Don't see it - but then I'm not a detail kind'a guy. I see forests not trees. So maybe I'm missing something, or maybe all the major changes are under the hood?

So help me out. What did my $39 get me that wasn't already in 3???

Seriously? How long ago did you pay for TOAW III? Do you think developers should work for free? I thing the $39 are well invested, even if not everything is brand new...

I could not understand the manual of TOAW 3 let alone the game.

I am now into the first quarter of the manual of TOAW 4 and all is well so far. And the game makes sense!

Also what is missing from Bob's link is that Ralph added a super Event to the Events list called Move Bias (plus or minus) which was a huge benefit to the Fire in the East 2 and Directive 21 scenarios.

If anyone could explain move bias, that would be great.