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USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:07 pm
by thedoctorking
I've created a couple of these SU's, but in a game on turn 12 they are still entirely empty. There's a few T-34's, no T-60's but a good number of the older light and medium tanks in the pool. What's up?
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:41 pm
by DeletedUser1769703214
ORIGINAL: thedoctorking
I've created a couple of these SU's, but in a game on turn 12 they are still entirely empty. There's a few T-34's, no T-60's but a good number of the older light and medium tanks in the pool. What's up?
It is just my opinion but building those independent Tank BN's you are shooting yourself in the foot since you are going to be desperately needing those light tanks for your tank brigades.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:50 pm
by No idea
ORIGINAL: thedoctorking
I've created a couple of these SU's, but in a game on turn 12 they are still entirely empty. There's a few T-34's, no T-60's but a good number of the older light and medium tanks in the pool. What's up?
The problem is unitl late 1942 your light tank production will be very low for all your needs. And tank battallions and tank brigades in 1941 and a good part of 1942 use llots of light tanks. So they fill very slowly.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:47 pm
by TheFox
I've done exactly the same - Turn 12 and 10 tank battalions refuse to leave Stalin's side despite numerous attempts to assign them to various Armies, they just reappear in Moscow as empty shells the very next turn!
Questions - would it be best to disband them or leave the AP's for other uses? [&:]
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:03 am
by No idea
ORIGINAL: TheFox
I've done exactly the same - Turn 12 and 10 tank battalions refuse to leave Stalin's side despite numerous attempts to assign them to various Armies, they just reappear in Moscow as empty shells the very next turn!
Questions - would it be best to disband them or leave the AP's for other uses? [&:]
You have already spent the APs, so better keep tham at Stavka. By late 1942, iirc, you will have enough light tanks, and not much later they will automatically upgrade to regiments, iirc, which will use medium tanks (and you will have lots and lots of medium tanks)
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:29 am
by 56ajax
ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain
ORIGINAL: thedoctorking
I've created a couple of these SU's, but in a game on turn 12 they are still entirely empty. There's a few T-34's, no T-60's but a good number of the older light and medium tanks in the pool. What's up?
It is just my opinion but building those independent Tank BN's you are shooting yourself in the foot since you are going to be desperately needing those light tanks for your tank brigades.
Well in 1941 just about every Russian unit is rubbish, so perhaps it doesn't matter what you create but a 42 Tank brigade has 46 tanks, manpower of 949 and trucks of 287 approx whereas a Tank battalion has 36, 209,128 respectively so a battalion is much more efficient use of resources. However you cannot control if they will ever fire their weapons in the general direction of Berlin, until they are assigned directly into your Corps, which doesnt happen until mid 1942.
So perhaps hold off creating battalions until the front settles down when the mud comes.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:44 am
by Nix77
ORIGINAL: 56ajax
However you cannot control if they will ever fire their weapons in the general direction of Berlin, until they are assigned directly into your Corps, which doesnt happen until mid 1942.
So perhaps hold off creating battalions until the front settles down when the mud comes.
You can attach them to cavalry corps in Dec'41 already. The earlier you create the battalions, the more experience they will have in the winter offensive. You can create them early, delay refitting your brigades and let the battalions fill up. With some experience, they are one of the strongest support units you can attach to your corps.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:24 pm
by thedoctorking
I was going to give them to the cavalry corps to give them a little more punch but still moving with non-motorized points. They are very useful for exploitation during the first winter counter-offensive.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:27 am
by Kantti
Problem with early Tank Bns is that they require T60. Its production starts only in October so they won't be gaining any experience before that unless they convert to use T26...
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:05 am
by Stelteck
If there is no T-60 they normaly can use T-26, T-40, T-50 and even BT-7.
Unfortunately you also need these obsolete tanks to fill your tank divisions and brigades.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:01 pm
by Kantti
In my current server game I built 10 tank bn's for upcoming winter offensive 3-4 turns ago. Now 5 of them have converted to T26 and are gaining experience. Rest are just empty shells on STAVKA and there's nothing I can do to change that.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:43 pm
by Denniss
How many T-26s do you have in active pool ?
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 3:55 am
by Kantti
All three (3)... Soviet tank pools at this stage are utter horror and quite easy to describe with a single digit, 0.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 6:12 am
by Stelteck
You have nearly zero light tank production in 1941, but sometimes when an armored division downgraded to tank brigade you get the excess tanks returned to pool and usable to others activities. Also you can stop tank divisions to renforce (or even downgrade them to low TOE) in order to preserve your light tanks stocks.
If you are desperate you can manually disband some tank divisions to get tanks but in this case you are loosing a future tank brigade so it is a difficult trade off.
I wonder if putting a armored division to 20% TOE accelerate their conversion to tank brigades (As tank divisions have probably a higher pourcentage to convert when low TOE). It could be interesting.
RE: USSR Independent Tank Bns not filling
Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 11:39 am
by DeletedUser1769703214
ORIGINAL: Stelteck
You have nearly zero light tank production in 1941, but sometimes when an armored division downgraded to tank brigade you get the excess tanks returned to pool and usable to others activities. Also you can stop tank divisions to renforce (or even downgrade them to low TOE) in order to preserve your light tanks stocks.
If you are desperate you can manually disband some tank divisions to get tanks but in this case you are loosing a future tank brigade so it is a difficult trade off.
I wonder if putting a armored division to 20% TOE accelerate their conversion to tank brigades (As tank divisions have probably a higher pourcentage to convert when low TOE). It could be interesting.
People lose too many tank divisions in 41 is part of the problem. Stop losing those divsions unnecessarly and you may have some light tanks. Also keeping all the brigades takes up to something like 37 toe in 41 until 42a where light tank toe goes to 16. So workon saving your tank divsion early game and you help solve the light tank problem .