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If someone understands the dynamics in Turkey I'd appreciate some information.

I am playing the Allies, the situation.


1) Turkey sides with Allies via Diplomacy.

2) My opponent takes Ankara and ALL of Turkey goes Axis

3) I retake every city/port EAST of Ankara (not Ankara).

3) Later a Turkish unit appears in Istanbul (opponent still controls everything WEST of & including Ankara) and Turkey then goes back Allied. All Axis cities (including unoccupied cities ) remain Axis.

4) My opponent then re takes Istanbul and ALL (including ones i captured) Turkish cities go back Axis. The cities I have troops in of course remain Allied but supply reduced.

5) I have now retaken Ankara and Turkey still Axis.

I don't see anything in manual but it could be there.

thanks

2. Presumably Turkey surrendered as any other country.

3 (2nd #3). How is a Turkish unit showing up in Istanbul? Perhaps this is a bug, or it wasn't a Turkish unit?

In any case it sounds like Turkey was liberated (though, why that would happen for Istanbul stumps me). In case of liberation, control of hexes do not change.

4. This is the second conquest/surrender of Turkey. Like the first territory is handed over. *Perhaps it shouldn't be, but this would require a patch if even possible.*

5. I believe after 2nd surrender, Turkey (as a political entity/minor country) is effectively out of the game for good.

Thanks Taxman - Happy Holidays

Its 3 & 4 that confuse me.

Ok first surrender (Ankara) Axis controls entire country - fine

Then this Turkish unit appears in Istanbul (several turns later) and I think the capital moves and then goes back Allied even tho he has multiple troops west of Ankara and controls Ankara. Honestly I should have paid more attention to the Istanbul situation.

Then Axis takes Istanbul and the entire country goes back Axis for the second time, even all the cities I captured. These two events are strange.

Anyway I'm against a dedicated player of equal ability and the game is a blast.

The key seems to be whether the country is classified as "occupied" or not. You can see if a country has this classification by clicking on any hex and looking at its affiliation. If diploed in, it will say, for example, Axis, if it was conquered, it will say Axis(occupied).
Upon initial taking of the capital, the whole country surrenders en mass. Once occupied, however, re-taking the capital does not liberate the rest of the country, it has to be re-taken hex by hex. It makes sense, as the occupiers do not simply give up when a particular city in the country they conquered surrenders. It's not their capital, so they could care less and fight on.

TY

My primary issue is Turkey capital was captured twice & all cities (which I had recaptured) were given to the Axis twice. Also Turkey went back Allied when a unit appeared in Istanbul way behind enemy lines.

The only thing I can think of is some funny mechanic of the capital moving to Istanbul at the same time as conquest, then a unit 'appears' and liberates Turkey.
There is probably a programming bug in there somewhere.

thanks

Probably a bug, the Istanbul unit appeared 6-8 turns after fall of Ankara

I've seen Bulgaria switch sides but never this.

I try to take Turkey (Diplomacy) as Allies for obvious reasons. Problem is the Axis airforce has much better supply in Eastern Europe than Allies in Turkey, big advantage.

time to move on

Was the unit that deployed in Istanbul a Partisan unit? That is the only Turkish unit that could understandably appear in the place while Turkey has a surrendered status.

Whether a country surrenders once or multiple times, its territory unless it is occupied by friendly non-native units, will pass to the country it surrenders to. I appreciate it must be frustrating when you've fought all that way and then the country surrenders. On the other hand, there could be the danger of unintended consequences if that rule were to be amended or abolished.

Istanbul is an Alternative Capital to Ankara, which is why Turkey was liberated when Istanbul returned to Allied hands.

If possible, perhaps keep some Soviet units in the Black Sea area ready to intervene if this ever happens again, in this game or another. I appreciate the Red Army doesn't always have units to spare mind!

Thanks Bill,

I had Soviet troops to re take the cities (had a bunch of garrisons & cavalry when he first took Ankara still there ), it just seemed strange that it would happen twice

The unit could have been a partisan (8 strength I think) I just found it also strange the capital would move to Istanbul when my opponent controlled Ankara and everything West.

Just wondering if their was something like Bulgaria that at times will switch sides.



Happy Holidays