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Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2021 9:21 pm
by Cavgunner
Hi all,
The Shadow Empire manual mentions that it is possible to build Wind Traps on planets that don't have surface water, but still have trace water vapor in the atmosphere (p. 200).
So here is the question: is it actually possible to have a planet with NO surface water but still with water vapor? This combination doesn't seem possible with a Seth-class planet, for example.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2021 10:43 pm
by Clux
Yes, its possible but somewhat rare, its more common on planets with advanced lifeforms (even if there isn't surface water). But even in that case, I wouldn't use them, since you need to build them in mountains its IP price its extremely high and they provide very little water, you would be better using deep core water extractors (I don't remember the exact name) or mining any underground water deposits
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:11 am
by Cavgunner
Thanks for the response. If there is water vapor on the world, will this be reported as a Trace Amount during planet generation?
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:21 am
by Maerchen
It is possible.
I won a game on a planet where there were only ice mining and wind traps were meaningful. Conquered some windtraps, and I discovered one. single. hex of permafrost ice that wouldn't melt during summer providing me with unlimited water access. All other ice mines were limited. And that hex was at the north pole, I started near the south pole.
Such resource-limited games are extra fun and another layer of difficulty.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:49 am
by Sieppo
ORIGINAL: Maerchen
It is possible.
I won a game on a planet where there were only ice mining and wind traps were meaningful. Conquered some windtraps, and I discovered one. single. hex of permafrost ice that wouldn't melt during summer providing me with unlimited water access. All other ice mines were limited. And that hex was at the north pole, I started near the south pole.
Such resource-limited games are extra fun and another layer of difficulty.
Damn sounds great! I've tried to create a planet where water REALLY is a problem. Like Dune etc but have not succeeded.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 2:36 pm
by Maerchen
It was very entertaining.
I uploaded the planetary info here:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... 2462307215
The spin was 17h.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 2:38 pm
by Sieppo
What planet type was it? I really need this for my next game [:D]
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 3:19 pm
by Maerchen
I think I went with unclassified. It is arid & cold, and a small planet.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... 2462304722 alien farming was possible.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:44 pm
by misterprimus
Wind traps are so inefficient, is it even possible to survive economically without hydroponic research at the very minimum to offset your overall farming manpower usage?
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:31 pm
by zgrssd
ORIGINAL: misterprimus
Wind traps are so inefficient, is it even possible to survive economically without hydroponic research at the very minimum to offset your overall farming manpower usage?
You are asking the wrong question. The real question is:
Can I farm
at all?
It is a terrible source of water. But it might well be the
only source of water early game.
And if you can not farm, you can not field any troops and die.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:44 pm
by misterprimus
ORIGINAL: zgrssd
ORIGINAL: misterprimus
Wind traps are so inefficient, is it even possible to survive economically without hydroponic research at the very minimum to offset your overall farming manpower usage?
You are asking the wrong question. The real question is:
Can I farm
at all?
It is a terrible source of water. But it might well be the
only source of water early game.
And if you can not farm, you can not field any troops and die.
I was in a similar situation one time. Only reason I had food (and no water) was because my level 3 farms just so happened to be private and private farms are magical farms that need no water.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:13 am
by mek42
I love it when xeno-farms require less water.
I too enjoy games where water is a strategic resource worth fighting for.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 1:34 am
by Cavgunner
I just want to chime in here again and say that I spent the better part of an hour trying to gen a planet with no bodies of water whatsoever, but I couldn't arrive at a combo that had BOTH a truly waterless surface (no ice either) AND atmospheric vapor. One of the posters above said that this was possible but I'm beginning to doubt it. Any further thoughts from anyone on this?
The point of this exercise is because in most games water is too easy to get in the early game, and I explicitly don't want that.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 3:15 am
by zgrssd
ORIGINAL: Cavgunner
I just want to chime in here again and say that I spent the better part of an hour trying to gen a planet with no bodies of water whatsoever, but I couldn't arrive at a combo that had BOTH a truly waterless surface (no ice either) AND atmospheric vapor. One of the posters above said that this was possible but I'm beginning to doubt it. Any further thoughts from anyone on this?
The point of this exercise is because in most games water is too easy to get in the early game, and I explicitly don't want that.
It is not nessesary to have no surface water. Just so little, that you propably start in a region without relevant water income.
Also keep in mind that the planet percentages only count actuall oceans - they completely ignore rivers and freshwater lakes. So it is possible there was still some surface water on that planet.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 3:19 am
by Cavgunner
To reiterate, yes it is necessary, because that is what I'm trying to achieve.
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Sun May 02, 2021 9:03 am
by zgrssd
ORIGINAL: Cavgunner
To reiterate, yes it is necessary, because that is what I'm trying to achieve.
Then you are intentionally trying to archieve the impossible, rather then the next feasible thing.
Going out of your way to fail, will not proove anything.
Just pointing that out, so you stop wasting time. [:)]
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Tue May 04, 2021 2:58 pm
by Cavgunner
As I noted above, the game manual indicated that a planet with zero surface water but still having atmospheric vapor was possible. I would like to attempt such a scenario because it's a challenge and because it would require the utilization of wind traps. If the game mechanics currently don't allow this that's fine, but that doesn't mean I'm wasting my time or failing intentionally.
(Edited because I may have let my temper get away from me, however, I hope I've made my logic perfectly clear- I want the challenge of having to rely on Wind Traps.)
RE: Wind Traps?
Posted: Fri May 14, 2021 6:06 pm
by BlueTemplar
My very first game, on Unclassified planet type, I ended up with a zero surface water + some atmospheric vapor.
I still didn't need to make any Wind Traps, because there were plentiful subterranean Ice deposits...