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Do you think that German air groups in SUD front particularly during the Desert war should be given a higher value compared to thoser on the Russian front (assuming for a minute that the Eastern Front operated like the SUD front where the value of the front was calculated)?

At the moment according to the house rules most players remove all the German air groups from SUD front and send them to Russia unless it has been agreed that the Axis player must maintain German air groups in SUD front. Therefore fighter cover and bombing are generally provided solely by Italian air groups.

If the value of German airgroups was higher and without them the front would have a higher/quicker chance of shattering would make it more realistic.

Thinking realistically the German air groups that were historically in the desert were there to provide decent air support to the Axis forces etc. Let's face it the Italians didn't appear to be putting up too much resistance prior to the arrival of the Afrika Korps and Luftwaffe.

What do you think and is it adjustable if there will be another version of WiR?

I can see the validity in your argument - have to think though is it possible to simulate this in WIR?

Related question - what do Air Groups in West Front/Italian Front add to combat calculation?

Related question - what do Air Groups in West Front/Italian Front add to combat calculation?

Try it out. It`s only a little bit more then nothing.

Originally posted by Speedy
I can see the validity in your argument - have to think though is it possible to simulate this in WIR?

Related question - what do Air Groups in West Front/Italian Front add to combat calculation?

I believe that this type of thing is already implemented, at least to an extent. I ran a quick test, and it looks like the game adds points for air units as follows: ready planes x experience. So a high experience air unit will add more strength to a front than a low experience one. I think this covers the difference between an elite German and a sub-par Italian air unit quite well, without a need for further changes. Any other thoughts?

And remember come the western Allies bomber offensive, there should then be a need for some kind of strong fighter presence to limit the attacks, unless fighting all out for the quick end to the war.

RickyB,

I see what you mean, but I think that in addition to my original argument is that:

Firstly you don't find that the AFV's of the 15th and 21st Pz Divisions have been decimated over the period of a month or several months because you had poor air cover. I'm sure the RAF would have had a field day if the Germans had pulled the Luftwaffe.

Secondly, without air cover Rommel would have had virtually no supplies (not that he had lots anyway) so Readiness and particularly AFV replacements in the Afrika Corps should be affected by air power as well.

Just suggestions if there will be an update.

RickyB

I understand, but the front is an abstraction and it just looks at total points as it is. If the Axis player builds up high experience Italian air units and uses them, they are as good as the German air units for what you are talking about. A 30 experience air unit is only contributing 1/3 the strength to the event checks as a 90 experience air unit, and so doesn't help out much against what the game checks, which is the total strength. If it wasn't abstracted, and all factors are taken into consideration, such as tank strength, air unit types, supply across the Med, etc, then I could see putting more effort into it, but for an abstraction, I don't see the reasonableness to concentrate on one abstract factor while ignoring the others that are just as important.

Basically, weak air groups reduce the strength of the front and make an event more likely. An even results in losses which is where heavy duty decimation occurs.

Rick,

I was thinking more along the lines of having something like the USAAF representing the RAF desert air force that would randomly interdict/bomb airfields of the SUD front thereby encouraging the Axis player to place stronger air units there initially until Italian units are trained up, at least during the desert war phase.

However, I realise that this would require considerable programming and research. Of course this issue can be avoided anyway by players making their own adjustments to the house rules. Although an abstraction I just thought that it was an interesting point.