Japanese Aircraft Engines Missing

[Wirraway_Ace]

I have been watching the pool of Nakajima Ha-35 for two months and I cannot make sense of it. I was producing 530 a month in three factories. All the factories show adequate supply and HI on site. The number produced is consistent with the target production, but the pool is declining even though I am building fewer aircraft requiring the engines (accounting for 1 or 2 engines per airframe).

Here is the current month. I started with 555 Ha-35s in the pool. I built 324 through the 18th of the month. During the same time frame, I built 11 Rufes, 21 Zeros, 17 Oscars, 18 Nicks (36 engines) and 37 Lily's (74 engines) for a total of 159 Ha-35 engines installed, but the pool of engines declined to 542. I am baffled! I have shut off most Zero and Oscar production to maintain the pool above 500.

[RangerJoe]

I have been watching the pool of Nakajima Ha-35 for two months and I cannot make sense of it. I was producing 530 a month in three factories. All the factories show adequate supply and HI on site. The number produced is consistent with the target production, but the pool is declining even though I am building fewer aircraft requiring the engines (accounting for 1 or 2 engines per airframe).

Here is the current month. I started with 555 Ha-35s in the pool. I built 324 through the 18th of the month. During the same time frame, I built 11 Rufes, 21 Zeros, 17 Oscars, 18 Nicks (36 engines) and 37 Lily's (74 engines) for a total of 159 Ha-35 engines installed, but the pool of engines declined to 542. I am baffled! I have shut off most Zero and Oscar production to maintain the pool above 500.

I do not think that the engines are missing. I think that if you check your Research Factories you will find that any fully repaired Research Factories are using an engine to double the Research Points produced which is done when the numbers of engines in the pool exceed 500.

[Wirraway_Ace]

I have been watching the pool of Nakajima Ha-35 for two months and I cannot make sense of it. I was producing 530 a month in three factories. All the factories show adequate supply and HI on site. The number produced is consistent with the target production, but the pool is declining even though I am building fewer aircraft requiring the engines (accounting for 1 or 2 engines per airframe).

Here is the current month. I started with 555 Ha-35s in the pool. I built 324 through the 18th of the month. During the same time frame, I built 11 Rufes, 21 Zeros, 17 Oscars, 18 Nicks (36 engines) and 37 Lily's (74 engines) for a total of 159 Ha-35 engines installed, but the pool of engines declined to 542. I am baffled! I have shut off most Zero and Oscar production to maintain the pool above 500.

I do not think that the engines are missing. I think that if you check your Research Factories you will find that any fully repaired Research Factories are using an engine to double the Research Points produced which is done when the numbers of engines in the pool exceed 500.

Ah, so that is the answer! I looked through the rules but did not see that as a mechanic and was apparently oblivious to it before.

[RangerJoe]

I have been watching the pool of Nakajima Ha-35 for two months and I cannot make sense of it. I was producing 530 a month in three factories. All the factories show adequate supply and HI on site. The number produced is consistent with the target production, but the pool is declining even though I am building fewer aircraft requiring the engines (accounting for 1 or 2 engines per airframe).

Here is the current month. I started with 555 Ha-35s in the pool. I built 324 through the 18th of the month. During the same time frame, I built 11 Rufes, 21 Zeros, 17 Oscars, 18 Nicks (36 engines) and 37 Lily's (74 engines) for a total of 159 Ha-35 engines installed, but the pool of engines declined to 542. I am baffled! I have shut off most Zero and Oscar production to maintain the pool above 500.

I do not think that the engines are missing. I think that if you check your Research Factories you will find that any fully repaired Research Factories are using an engine to double the Research Points produced which is done when the numbers of engines in the pool exceed 500.

Ah, so that is the answer! I looked through the rules but did not see that as a mechanic and was apparently oblivious to it before.

I took a quick look in the manual and I think that it was added later.

One thing to note, you usage of that engine early is high but it will drop towards the end of the war. So have some factories smaller so they can convert later or even go into research once the need for them has decreased.

[RangerJoe]

I have been watching the pool of Nakajima Ha-35 for two months and I cannot make sense of it. I was producing 530 a month in three factories. All the factories show adequate supply and HI on site. The number produced is consistent with the target production, but the pool is declining even though I am building fewer aircraft requiring the engines (accounting for 1 or 2 engines per airframe).

Here is the current month. I started with 555 Ha-35s in the pool. I built 324 through the 18th of the month. During the same time frame, I built 11 Rufes, 21 Zeros, 17 Oscars, 18 Nicks (36 engines) and 37 Lily's (74 engines) for a total of 159 Ha-35 engines installed, but the pool of engines declined to 542. I am baffled! I have shut off most Zero and Oscar production to maintain the pool above 500.

I do not think that the engines are missing. I think that if you check your Research Factories you will find that any fully repaired Research Factories are using an engine to double the Research Points produced which is done when the numbers of engines in the pool exceed 500.

Ah, so that is the answer! I looked through the rules but did not see that as a mechanic and was apparently oblivious to it before.

Actually, I misspoke. The Research outpoint is increased by 1 for every factory that produced at least one point. So if the Research Factory would normally produce 2 points with the engine bonus it would produce 3 points. This is one reason why a 30 point Research Factory is the optimal size.

[Chris21wen]

Actually, I misspoke. The Research outpoint is increased by 1 for every factory that produced at least one point. So if the Research Factory would normally produce 2 points with the engine bonus it would produce 3 points. This is one reason why a 30 point Research Factory is the optimal size.

As you just said. Basically one engine used for every research point bonus gained. With a size 30 that works out to be ~1 bonus point per day per factory.

Putting some maths too it and hoping my maths are correct here.
Don't know how many factories you have fully repaired but assuming 30 in each factory and taking the A6M5 there's at least 6 factories so that's an extra 6 engines, then throw in the Oscar IIb with 3 then you have across the two ~9 engines per day, ~270 engines per month. If the individual factories are larger than 30 then the overall bonus is less with fewer engines being used (and it's my guesss that this is the case here). So you can see research is not as cheap as many make it out to be.

[Chris21wen]

One thing I'm curiuos about. Why are you researching both the Oscar IIa and IIb? In stock the IIa upgrades to the IIb hence so do the factories at no extra cost in supply or time.

Looking at your IIb available date it has advanced a month so if you had spent the research on the IIa it would have advanced a month, effectively advancing all the the Oscars in the upgrade chain, including the IIb. This is because the factory does not have to spend time repairing before you start to research the a/c. For an a/c with an available date 6 months hence I always estimate that it takes a research factory ~5 months to get from 0 to 30 depending upon die rolls. The further off the original available date is the longer it takes. If you have factories >30 then it takes even longer.

I estimate that if you had spent all your Oscar research on the IIa and kept factory size to 30 you would be close to getting it any time soon.

[Wirraway_Ace]

One thing I'm curiuos about. Why are you researching both the Oscar IIa and IIb? In stock the IIa upgrades to the IIb hence so do the factories at no extra cost in supply or time.

Looking at your IIb available date it has advanced a month so if you had spent the research on the IIa it would have advanced a month, effectively advancing all the the Oscars in the upgrade chain, including the IIb. This is because the factory does not have to spend time repairing before you start to research the a/c. For an a/c with an available date 6 months hence I always estimate that it takes a research factory ~5 months to get from 0 to 30 depending upon die rolls. The further off the original available date is the longer it takes. If you have factories >30 then it takes even longer.

I estimate that if you had spent all your Oscar research on the IIa and kept factory size to 30 you would be close to getting it any time soon.

Chris,
thanks for the note. I was not aware that if I advance the IIa a month, the IIb will advance a month too. For example, if the IIa goes from 11/42 to 10/42, does the IIb advance from 5/43 to 4/43? I have been treating them as independent delivery dates.

[Wirraway_Ace]

Actually, I misspoke. The Research outpoint is increased by 1 for every factory that produced at least one point. So if the Research Factory would normally produce 2 points with the engine bonus it would produce 3 points. This is one reason why a 30 point Research Factory is the optimal size.

As you just said. Basically one engine used for every research point bonus gained. With a size 30 that works out to be ~1 bonus point per day per factory.

Putting some maths too it and hoping my maths are correct here.
Don't know how many factories you have fully repaired but assuming 30 in each factory and taking the A6M5 there's at least 6 factories so that's an extra 6 engines, then throw in the Oscar IIb with 3 then you have across the two ~9 engines per day, ~270 engines per month. If the individual factories are larger than 30 then the overall bonus is less with fewer engines being used (and it's my guesss that this is the case here). So you can see research is not as cheap as many make it out to be.

Yes, the maths match the empirical evidence. I was "missing" about 270 engines per month. No, the accelerated research is not cheap.

[Chris21wen]

Chris,
thanks for the note. I was not aware that if I advance the IIa a month, the IIb will advance a month too. For example, if the IIa goes from 11/42 to 10/42, does the IIb advance from 5/43 to 4/43? I have been treating them as independent delivery dates.

Your correct it doesn't but I said effectively advancing due to not needing to repair the factory. I.e you go straight into research. One fully repaired size 30 factory will give you 1 research point per day. After 100 days (little over 3 months) the a/c will advance one month. It takes, at the barest minimum, 4 months (I work on 5) to full repair a size 30 factory if that factory is due between 6 -12 months time. The further away it's due date the longer it takes to repair. It's all about the repair of the factories where time is gained or lost.

Hyperthetically assume you had an a/c due on the 1 Jul 42 and its upgrade 1 Jul 45. Using 3x30 research factoies that all need to repairing from start you are likely to be fully repaired after 5 moths and the 1st a/c advanced one a month early to Jun 42.

Some very loose appoximations here; 3x30 factories will approx advance an a/c one month every month. The second a/c in due 36 month time; your advancing it one month every month so meeting in the middle you get the aircraft in 18 months time (Dec 43). If you had to repair the factories for the second a/c you would have to wait until at least early 44 for them to be fully repaired before you even start generating RPs.

None of this takes into account the possible engine bonus.

Again hope my maths stand up.