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Tanaka wrote: Sun Oct 30, 2022 3:53 pm Any historical offensive is out of the question you are always on the defensive and for the first time I find myself getting crushed by the Russians in MP and will probably soon lose the capital of Helsinki surrendering the entire country. Of course various factors can come into play. I've seen some posts commenting on missing units and missing fronts. Just curious what are players opinions on this?

OldCrowBalthazor wrote: Mon Oct 31, 2022 4:06 am

Tanaka wrote: Sun Oct 30, 2022 3:53 pm Any historical offensive is out of the question you are always on the defensive and for the first time I find myself getting crushed by the Russians in MP and will probably soon lose the capital of Helsinki surrendering the entire country. Of course various factors can come into play. I've seen some posts commenting on missing units and missing fronts. Just curious what are players opinions on this?

Well, I have been squawking about Finland's starting position come Barbarossa for along time mainly with War in Europe. There is no Karelian Army Group. Same goes for WaW. Their should be at least 2 corps at and near Joensuu in SC-World at War. I would actually have most of the Finn units that are available to build in the German production already on the map..as Finland was fully mobilized in early 1941. No need for the Germans to have to build them up before hand. Anyways thats my opinion.

At least I got my Finland fix..as both Chrispy131313 and Lothos addressed this issue for WiE with their respective mods, Chrispy's Fall Wiess II and Lothos's TRP mod.
Image is a screen shot of Finland's dispositions circa pre-Barbarossa withe Lothos's TRP-WiE mod. Also images of one of my Europa modules with a Finland map [images] which was used with other maps of the western Soviet Union when conducting East Front matches on the table.

Again..for SC-WW2 World at War...Yeah, I think Finland should be beefed up somewhat as stated above.
Cheers

archmache wrote: Mon Oct 31, 2022 2:55 pm I've always thought it would be cool (no idea how to code) that when you winter war as Russia that you could actually fight the Finns. But you would not be 100% mobilized. So you could attack Finland, but since your only making like 120 MPP, any damage you take in the war would hamper your R&D, so it would eventually force you to make peace with Finland.

You could start by having the troops in low readiness and strength and then fight like that the entire time but getting them to full strength would be too expensive which would cause MPP loss.

Tanaka wrote: Mon Oct 31, 2022 4:23 pm Interesting idea. This begs the question as I do not play allies much can Russian declare war on Finland at any time before Winter War event or Barbarossa? If yes what are the effects? If so what would be the negatives positives?

BillRunacre wrote: Tue Nov 01, 2022 9:49 am

Tanaka wrote: Mon Oct 31, 2022 4:23 pm Interesting idea. This begs the question as I do not play allies much can Russian declare war on Finland at any time before Winter War event or Barbarossa? If yes what are the effects? If so what would be the negatives positives?

They cannot, as only fully mobilized Majors can declare war. This is why it's handled by a Decision Event.

Zeckke wrote: Tue Nov 01, 2022 7:42 pm Finland is strog, in this game but will be more strong geting SWEEDEN axis. which is easy by diplomacy, the 3 units finland plus the two divisions from sweeden and the cops sending to finland make a strong mix.

so go for sweeden by diplo and send the 3 sweeden units to finland

you can teach the AI getting sweeden, as for example i teach the AI always to get yugoeslavia

Chernobyl wrote: Tue Nov 01, 2022 4:50 am I'm not an expert on the Continuation War or Karelian geography but I was toying around with the map and here is what I imagined:

Tanaka wrote: Wed Nov 02, 2022 4:31 pm Is this just a map change? The straight shot to Petrozavodsk? I feel like this would make things easier for the Russians if the additional Fin units are not added...

Chernobyl wrote: Thu Nov 03, 2022 12:07 am

Tanaka wrote: Wed Nov 02, 2022 4:31 pm Is this just a map change? The straight shot to Petrozavodsk? I feel like this would make things easier for the Russians if the additional Fin units are not added...

Well yes I only changed the map as I didn't do any deep research on Finnish force composition. I was hesitant to provide them with more corps as I'm not sure it matches their actual forces (they get a whole "Army" which counts for quite a bit).

I was considering giving the Finns an additional corps starting in Joensuu.

I altered the road to more closely match maps I found online and the actual direction of the Finnish attacks in 1941. There should probably be a river between lakes Ladoga and Onega. There really isn't a road between Joensuu and Belmorsk as depicted on the vanilla map.

Tanaka wrote: Thu Nov 03, 2022 6:28 pm Gotcha but how would they attack there without the extra units?

OldCrowBalthazor wrote: Fri Nov 04, 2022 10:52 am I would also suggest 1 Finn corps in Joensuu...as Chernobyl suggested. It could come from the build que...so no change from the total OOB of Finland...it just wouldn't have to be built.
The Finn's had a considerable force there in 41...and at least the Soviets would not just walk right in north of Ladoga.
This would fit with the WaW scale and wouldn't upset balance...as it would still be easy for the Soviets to block an advance on the Murmansk RR or Volkhov.