Matrix Games Forums

First I have to say I am playing with patch 1.02.52 so maybe later patches its back in the the roster however I cant recall reading in the patch notes of later patches about its inclusion of course I could have missed it.
If it is in fact in a later patch then all fine, when I finish my current AAR and then upgrade all good but if its missing is there a reason why ?

regards

I see it starting in the NA TB at the start of StoB in the latest version. Don't remember any changes with it. Could it have been destroyed in North Africa and not returned for rebuild in your game?

Joel Billings wrote: Wed Dec 04, 2024 11:35 pm I see it starting in the NA TB at the start of StoB in the latest version. Don't remember any changes with it. Could it have been destroyed in North Africa and not returned for rebuild in your game?

Hi
Just checked "destroyed units turn 26 " and its confirmed that the 21st Pz was destroyed in North Africa which is fine all historical, I just thought it would be reformed as it was historically and sent to the " western theatre box ".



This is from Wikipedia

1943
By the time it reached Tunis, 21st Panzer had ceased to exist as a cohesive unit and was split up into Battle Groups (Kampfgruppen) Pfeiffer and Gruen. They were subsequently renamed Battle Groups Stenkhoff and Schuette, which took part in the Battle of Kasserine Pass. Major General Von Hulsen surrendered the remnants of the division on 13 May 1943.

After Africa, the division was reformed in Europe, where it garrisoned Caen, until 16th field luftwaffe division relieved it of its duty. It was then moved to Paris, where it remained for rehabilitation and garrison duty until the Allied landings at Normandy. The new division's commander was Oberst Edgar Feuchtinger who was promoted to Generalmajor on 1 August 1943 and Generalleutenant (equivalent to Major-General) exactly a year later. It was heavily engaged in the fighting at the Normandy beachheads, being the only Panzer division to engage the Allies on the first day.

The division was formed from the elements of the newly created Schnelle Division West (Fast Division West), a newly designed, highly mobile type of formation that was intended to be able to cover a great deal of territory to reach a point of invasion. It was thought that a number of these formations would be set up in France, each with greater mobility and transport than a standard panzer division. German industry was unable to provide the vehicles for these units, and only a single brigade was formed, known as Schnelle Brigade West. This was largely fitted out with captured French half tracks and light tanks that had been armoured and up-gunned by a mechanical engineer by the name of Alfred Becker. Working at a conversion facility near Paris called Baukommando Becker, Becker provided the unit with most of its transport and all of its assault guns. On June 17, 1943 Schnelle Brigade West was upgraded to Schnelle Division West, and on June 27, 1943, was assigned the name 21st Panzer Division in memory of the unit that had fought and been captured in North Africa. Major Becker was assigned the command of the division's assault gun battalion, Panzerjäger-Abteilung 200. The division was under the command of Rommel, who was responsible for German forces from the Netherlands to the Loire.


If there is a random effect " in game " that units that are destroyed in " theatre boxes " may not return to the reinforcement pool even though they may have been reconstituted historically, that's fine guess 21st Panzer rolled the dice but missed out.

regards

AFAIR all german units shall rebuild unless forbidden in unit data

In some test games I looked at, I see they are returning as shells in C41, but not in StoB, when they are destroyed in North Africa. I see that the units are locked in StoB but not locked in C41. Maybe there is a condition that locked units don't return? I'm guessing now, but that's what jumped out at me as the difference in data between the two scenarios.

in the current StoB version both PzD are unlocked. They are locked in the NEE version though.
anyway a TB lock should not prevent unit rebuilds, that' what the unit flag is for

The NEE and normal StoB scenario files should be identical. I just checked my copies and they're locked in both.

The locking is just a guess as to what might be causing the difference in behavior between the scenarios.