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Spotting recon/scout units at long range is too easy in the NTC map.

Posted: Wed Dec 18, 2024 7:39 am
by mmacguinness
Spotting recon/scout units at long range is too easy in the NTC map.
I first posted about this on the AB forum over three years ago, but got no reaction from the AB team. I assumed it would be fixed in AB2, but it has not been.
For example: The scout team with SOP Cover:Hold:Hold is taken under fire from ranges over 900m, Happens every single time.
NTC Scout team under fire from over 900m.jpg
NTC Scout team under fire from over 900m.jpg (61.98 KiB) Viewed 512 times
Referring to the manual, the reason is:
5.1.17. Hiding
Non-vehicle units can remain completely hidden from the enemy, if they do not fire and are dug-in, remain stationary in terrain that has a concealment value greater than zero,

In the NTC map, every single non-road map tile that I have checked, without exception, has the following properties:
Inf Trafficability: 90 Height: Variable
Veh Trafficability: 80 Relief: 25
Concealment : 0 Cover: 0

Thus, on the NTC as mapped by AB & AB2, if there is Line of Sight, a Scout team or any other unit or vehicle is as visible as a ball on a pool table.

It appears as if the map designer has a concept of the NTC as a barren, vegetation free desert as in the photo below, but flatter
Desert.png
Desert.png (650.39 KiB) Viewed 512 times

This does not conform to reality.
Within the NTC areas as mapped by AB, there are two roads that can be viewed in Google Street Map, Fort Irwin Road and a section of the I-15 in the Cronese Valley in the SW of the map area.
The following screenshots were taken at these locations:
Fort Irwin Road:
NTC Fort Irwin Road looking West.jpg
NTC Fort Irwin Road looking West.jpg (213.45 KiB) Viewed 512 times
I-15 Cronese Valley
NTC I-15 Cronese Valley looking South.jpg
NTC I-15 Cronese Valley looking South.jpg (370.2 KiB) Viewed 512 times
Clearly, there is more than enough vegetation in the NTC to provide good concealment for a recon team or any other infantry unit.
There would also be excellent cover and concealment in hilltop positions if these were not covered by no-go prohibitions. In reality, all of the hills and ridges in the NTC are traversable by infantry units with more or less difficulty. Noted that even though prohibited by AB no-go restrictions, these map tiles have the same Inf Trafficability value as tile on the flat terrain.

Re: Spotting recon/scout units at long range is too easy in the NTC map.

Posted: Thu Dec 19, 2024 7:21 pm
by Veitikka
We considered disabling the desert environment in AB2 until it has been reworked, but decided to make it available so the NTC map can be loaded. When there will be new content using the environment it needs to be improved.

Re: Spotting recon/scout units at long range is too easy in the NTC map.

Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2026 3:05 am
by mmacguinness
It's been a while now.

Since the cause of the spotting issue on the NTC map is the fact that the Cover and Concealment values for all tiles are set to 0, making it essentially a glass-like surface, surely this could be easily and quickly fixed as an interim measure pending a more comprehensive rework of the map by simply making a global change to set these to a value more representative of the actual nature of he terrain, broken ground with patches of dried grass/small bushes/scrub?

There are other issues with the NTC map but they are very minor in comparison. Simply resetting the C&C values would greatly improve he map.

Before I identified the cause, it was merely very frustrating. Now that I have identified the problem, I consider the lack of Cover and Concealment to be so serious an omission that the NTC map is effectively unplayable.