German Jaeger and Mountain Divisions
Posted: Sat Dec 21, 2024 8:50 am
Here an little Errata on the TOEs, Manpower and implications about their current state.
I also have found some earlier TOEs and manpower Numbers (altough not that material available to me as of now). I will add those in another Post in this Thread once worked through.
If you find errors, have further info, ideas and so on, sharing is appreciated.
TOEs:
For now it is mostly about the 1944 reworks of the Divisional TOEs [OB:604, OB:611].
Attached are 2 Pictures, which show the current TOEs of the 44 variants and "correct" them.
Again the issue about SP Flak and Panzerschreck Squads came up.
Regimental AT for MtDiv44:
There are some other TOEs floating around showing the Regimental 2x3xPak40 being exchanged for 2x3xLeIG37. But it is also often mentioned that surplus 5cm or other types could have been kept if still available. As a middleground I guess keeping the initially planned Pak40 is a good idea since they are usually surplus available in game, contrary to IRL (Pak generally die too little but that's another issue). Additionally the LeIG37 in game does not understand that it is supposed to be an AT Gun replacement and it is also rather scarce.
What could be also done is to remove 3xPak40 and add 6xPak38 ("50mm leftover Pak") as another middleground.
Manpower:
Additionally, I added a collage of varying Mapower calculations (the lowest ones (the small quaders) I can not 100% pinpoint to a certain date.). The suggested Manpower values are mentioned in the two TOE pics.
Not yet sure how to handle the whole "mountain use/flat land use" situation. Without proper modding options to terrain and limited elite tags there can't be a perfect solution, other than bloating the unit with support for no actual improvement. The collage also includes order as to which Divisions in which theatres are supposed to be used in which setup.
Squads:
Some notes on the TOE pics. Further see this post.
What stands out is that both line infantry Squads remained 10Men Squads. Opposed to normal Infanry Divisions. Another sign for how to treat Jägers appropriately different to normal Infantry (as suggested in the following section).
Regarding the Jäger Divisions performance:
Currently the Jaeger Divisions initially are simply small IDs in game, even when regular IDs Rifle Squad numbers go down - Jaeger Divisions Squad numbers go down even further. All this without acknowledging their benefits, which they can not rly make use of in game since all Infantry TOEs always have more Support than needed, MPs are the same and there are no terrain bonuses for them. Part of the surplus of support is a large number of Officers, which can be seen in the Manpower Collage. Therefore some kind of "elite" status should be applied to those Divisions, altough for sure not +15NM, maybe we will get some additional Elite Flags, this would be perfect modding solution to this.
But since it is unlikely we will ever get additional Elite Flags, I'd suggest:
Due to their similarity in TOEs, increased officers, Equipment/horses, and differentiation between mountain/flat land use one could make use of this by making them Mountaineers (but maintaining the "L" logo). This serves the purpose to increase their small TOE effect/efficiency by making them at least +5NM and accounts for many more Support/Officers in such Divisions. Additionally some of those Divisions had rather large numbers of Iron Cross recipients, so giving them some Elite Status seems appropriate. Ideally they would only have halve the bonuses fighting in Mountains but also some additional bonus when fighting in Rough (but that's all unfortunately not moddable).
Further notes on earlier TOEs (not definitve since lack of information for now).
The Manpower the 10/1943 TOE could about have can be seen in the Collage, dated 08.01.1944 it states 14815Men.
The Manpower for 03/1943 TOE could be about 15872Men - again not a definitive answer, it is a calculation (I assume) of the 100th Jaeger Division in July 1943 - since the 100th its TOE is attached to the calculation. TOE errata will follow in hope to find more information about that. Interestingly it is showing 12x20mm Flak in the AT Battalion already.
But as mentioned initially, there will be a separate Thread about the earlier TOEs at one point in time when my sources allow.
I also have found some earlier TOEs and manpower Numbers (altough not that material available to me as of now). I will add those in another Post in this Thread once worked through.
If you find errors, have further info, ideas and so on, sharing is appreciated.
TOEs:
For now it is mostly about the 1944 reworks of the Divisional TOEs [OB:604, OB:611].
Attached are 2 Pictures, which show the current TOEs of the 44 variants and "correct" them.
Again the issue about SP Flak and Panzerschreck Squads came up.
Regimental AT for MtDiv44:
There are some other TOEs floating around showing the Regimental 2x3xPak40 being exchanged for 2x3xLeIG37. But it is also often mentioned that surplus 5cm or other types could have been kept if still available. As a middleground I guess keeping the initially planned Pak40 is a good idea since they are usually surplus available in game, contrary to IRL (Pak generally die too little but that's another issue). Additionally the LeIG37 in game does not understand that it is supposed to be an AT Gun replacement and it is also rather scarce.
What could be also done is to remove 3xPak40 and add 6xPak38 ("50mm leftover Pak") as another middleground.
Manpower:
Additionally, I added a collage of varying Mapower calculations (the lowest ones (the small quaders) I can not 100% pinpoint to a certain date.). The suggested Manpower values are mentioned in the two TOE pics.
Not yet sure how to handle the whole "mountain use/flat land use" situation. Without proper modding options to terrain and limited elite tags there can't be a perfect solution, other than bloating the unit with support for no actual improvement. The collage also includes order as to which Divisions in which theatres are supposed to be used in which setup.
Squads:
Some notes on the TOE pics. Further see this post.
What stands out is that both line infantry Squads remained 10Men Squads. Opposed to normal Infanry Divisions. Another sign for how to treat Jägers appropriately different to normal Infantry (as suggested in the following section).
Regarding the Jäger Divisions performance:
Currently the Jaeger Divisions initially are simply small IDs in game, even when regular IDs Rifle Squad numbers go down - Jaeger Divisions Squad numbers go down even further. All this without acknowledging their benefits, which they can not rly make use of in game since all Infantry TOEs always have more Support than needed, MPs are the same and there are no terrain bonuses for them. Part of the surplus of support is a large number of Officers, which can be seen in the Manpower Collage. Therefore some kind of "elite" status should be applied to those Divisions, altough for sure not +15NM, maybe we will get some additional Elite Flags, this would be perfect modding solution to this.
But since it is unlikely we will ever get additional Elite Flags, I'd suggest:
Due to their similarity in TOEs, increased officers, Equipment/horses, and differentiation between mountain/flat land use one could make use of this by making them Mountaineers (but maintaining the "L" logo). This serves the purpose to increase their small TOE effect/efficiency by making them at least +5NM and accounts for many more Support/Officers in such Divisions. Additionally some of those Divisions had rather large numbers of Iron Cross recipients, so giving them some Elite Status seems appropriate. Ideally they would only have halve the bonuses fighting in Mountains but also some additional bonus when fighting in Rough (but that's all unfortunately not moddable).
Further notes on earlier TOEs (not definitve since lack of information for now).
The Manpower the 10/1943 TOE could about have can be seen in the Collage, dated 08.01.1944 it states 14815Men.
The Manpower for 03/1943 TOE could be about 15872Men - again not a definitive answer, it is a calculation (I assume) of the 100th Jaeger Division in July 1943 - since the 100th its TOE is attached to the calculation. TOE errata will follow in hope to find more information about that. Interestingly it is showing 12x20mm Flak in the AT Battalion already.
But as mentioned initially, there will be a separate Thread about the earlier TOEs at one point in time when my sources allow.
And the setups also occasionally changed to you'd not get a "perfect" Squad anyways.
). So I assume they just blew up the Panzerschrecks to be actually regularly used/assigned (and the 54 is not just an "36+18Reserve" depicted the wrong way). But removing the Pak Platoon and adding an additional PzB Platoon gives 166Men, so no clue how the hell they added 20more men additionally?!
)