Next steps for SC WiE Tournament score and entirely new version
Posted: Thu Jan 23, 2025 1:56 pm
THIS IS ALSO POSTED with updates here: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/view ... 9#p5045899
As a player since the start (version 2,) a manager of early ELO SC WiE tournaments, and a player in all 3 WiE tournaments, I would like to make the following observations/suggestions:
1. WiE is an outstanding "Game" not a simulation but a "Game." ELO results show that both sides can win the 1939 scenario.
2. As El Condoro said in a post on SC WaW forum I paraphrase: "Between well-matched players, the Axis can’t avoid a strategic loss in the 1943 and later scenarios." I agree. This suggests that the means of determining the win score could be tweaked to represent better the results and the skills of both players in doing better than the historical results. How about this: 8 May is the base and worth 100 points. Every turn the Allies win earlier gets 5 more points. Every turn after that Allies subtract points. It should be on a sliding scale 2 points for one turn, 4 points for two turns, 6 points for three turns, and so on.
3. Another suggestion for determining victory points. Direct unit loss does not accurately reflect combat effectiveness loss. For example, I believe the current system gives equal value to the loss of a garrison and a Headquarters or a heavy tank. As a player, I would rather lose 8 garrisons over a single HQs. A more accurate representation would be lost MPPs. The game already keeps track. In this case, the loss of a HQs is 405 versus 50 for a garrison. NOTE: The original post on calculations says uses MPP losses, but the end result summary looks like the calculation is using units.
4. I think the game does a reasonably good simulation of supply and the effects of HQs. This simulation is complex and many times difficult to determine on the fly. Currently, you have to move the HQs to see the results in the future. This can be visualized but if you are doing a two HQs move then this becomes too complex, for me anyway, to understand the effects. As a retired Army combat officer, I would have asked my G4 to figure supply out. SC needs a G4. Some way to take a snapshot of the current unit, terrain, and weather situation and be able to move HQs around to see the supply effects without committing to that move and without giving any intel away.
5. Lastly SC WiE is 6 years old. Matrix has been getting $$ off of SC WiE offshoots like SC Pacific and Civil War etc. It is time for an upgrade to SC engine with new stuff that engages current and new players to purchase SC WiE version 4. Perhaps some of the excellent work done by Lothos on “TRP” could be used. I think lots of good ideas there, but SC WiE loses its flavor as a game with all the changes Lothos has made as it becomes more of a simulation with way too many units for my taste. I would suggest putting a thread out on the forum titled “Suggestions needed for the next version of SC WiE.” Find out what the community wants and will be willing to pay for in an upgrade. Should also announce on the Discord channel. Note: If you want complex Gary Grigsby's War in the East or World in Flames are the ones to go to.
As a player since the start (version 2,) a manager of early ELO SC WiE tournaments, and a player in all 3 WiE tournaments, I would like to make the following observations/suggestions:
1. WiE is an outstanding "Game" not a simulation but a "Game." ELO results show that both sides can win the 1939 scenario.
2. As El Condoro said in a post on SC WaW forum I paraphrase: "Between well-matched players, the Axis can’t avoid a strategic loss in the 1943 and later scenarios." I agree. This suggests that the means of determining the win score could be tweaked to represent better the results and the skills of both players in doing better than the historical results. How about this: 8 May is the base and worth 100 points. Every turn the Allies win earlier gets 5 more points. Every turn after that Allies subtract points. It should be on a sliding scale 2 points for one turn, 4 points for two turns, 6 points for three turns, and so on.
3. Another suggestion for determining victory points. Direct unit loss does not accurately reflect combat effectiveness loss. For example, I believe the current system gives equal value to the loss of a garrison and a Headquarters or a heavy tank. As a player, I would rather lose 8 garrisons over a single HQs. A more accurate representation would be lost MPPs. The game already keeps track. In this case, the loss of a HQs is 405 versus 50 for a garrison. NOTE: The original post on calculations says uses MPP losses, but the end result summary looks like the calculation is using units.
4. I think the game does a reasonably good simulation of supply and the effects of HQs. This simulation is complex and many times difficult to determine on the fly. Currently, you have to move the HQs to see the results in the future. This can be visualized but if you are doing a two HQs move then this becomes too complex, for me anyway, to understand the effects. As a retired Army combat officer, I would have asked my G4 to figure supply out. SC needs a G4. Some way to take a snapshot of the current unit, terrain, and weather situation and be able to move HQs around to see the supply effects without committing to that move and without giving any intel away.
5. Lastly SC WiE is 6 years old. Matrix has been getting $$ off of SC WiE offshoots like SC Pacific and Civil War etc. It is time for an upgrade to SC engine with new stuff that engages current and new players to purchase SC WiE version 4. Perhaps some of the excellent work done by Lothos on “TRP” could be used. I think lots of good ideas there, but SC WiE loses its flavor as a game with all the changes Lothos has made as it becomes more of a simulation with way too many units for my taste. I would suggest putting a thread out on the forum titled “Suggestions needed for the next version of SC WiE.” Find out what the community wants and will be willing to pay for in an upgrade. Should also announce on the Discord channel. Note: If you want complex Gary Grigsby's War in the East or World in Flames are the ones to go to.