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The late war super E's that I've seen others write about are devastating. My unscientific study says that they perform better than USN or RN ASW at half or sometimes less than the Allied TF size. (most of the encounters are in deep blue ocean.)


Questions are,

1. Has this been fixed with later patches?

2. If not ,since I'm close to starting a new game ,any recommendations on fixing it myself prior to starting the next?

Thanks!

Late war Japanese escorts were toned down in previous patches, but they still pack a heavy punch. Part of the issue is that the code for the Japanese ability to detect subs improves as the game goes on from outright dismal to kinda okay. That hand-in-hand with a new class of dedicated escort vessels with a decent array of dc throwers and radar installed as standard makes their debut seem rather dramatic compared to the ASW fleet the USN was mostly facing before. Converted merchantmen, subchasers and such. You could try editing down the number of ASW weapon launchers a Japanese destroyer escort has before beginning a new game.

Given that the IJN did not expand in size by the same ratio as the Allied navies, their average crew experience should be higher. That's one factor.
Maybe the other is that Allies subs are in just about every shipping lane hex by late 1943 so dropping a DC anywhere might hit one!

Also, one forum member did a detailed study of sub skipper aggression vs results and found that super-aggressive skippers get their crews killed eventually. Moderately aggressive skippers seem to have more patience, rarely make gun attacks and avoid escorted convoys in shallow water.

Don't forget that there is usually a concentrated emphasis on both Naval Search and ASW search in the areas where the Allied submarines are operating, a spotted submarine is ineffective while also allowing the ASW TF and escorts the knowledge that a submarine is in the area. One TF will search for the submarine and try to destroy it while the other TF will try to avoid it.

As I stated in another thread; a suppressed sub should be the goal, damage or sinking one is a bonus.

A big part of the historical difference is that players tend to use optimal ASW methods, while historically the japanese tended to use quite sub-optimal.

Air ASW/Naval Search combined with ASW TF's focused in fixed areas will work extremely well. The Air portion is mostly to get the DL on the SS and then the TF's are to prosecute those findings. Even early war, if the IJ use these technique's they can enjoy FAR greater success than historical outcomes.

As Dr. Hal notes above: detection alone will stop most SS encounters with IJ convoys. But combine detection (high DL) with ASW TF's to prosecute and you can decimate the allied SS fleet unless they react to the threat.

Thanks all for the detailed answers to the questions! Does anyone know off hand when the E class appears with the radar and better DC throwers....? I'd like to know for future reference. Have a great day all!

SuluSea wrote: Wed Apr 02, 2025 5:31 pm Thanks all for the detailed answers to the questions! Does anyone know off hand when the E class appears with the radar and better DC throwers....? I'd like to know for future reference. Have a great day all!

Generally, around November 1943 you start to see the Etorofu and Mikura class escorts showing up with the Type 22 radar already fitted, a decent suite of DC throwers and the anti-submarine mortar.

SuluSea wrote: Wed Apr 02, 2025 5:31 pm Thanks all for the detailed answers to the questions! Does anyone know off hand when the E class appears with the radar and better DC throwers....? I'd like to know for future reference. Have a great day all!

SuluSea...my man. Long time no see, bud.

For the most part, Q1 1944 is when they start regularly showing up. A few in the trailing days of 1943, but the bulk show up in 1944.

Hoping you are well Chickenboy! Thanks all for the responses, you all are fantastic!