Matrix Games Forums

I'm very interested in a number of matrixgames products, but why the refusal to offer a download service, nor any shipment methods other than the most expensive option available? As it is, a $30 game costs me $72.94. If I want KP, that's $92.94, plus a restock wait. The vast majority of these games will never appear in stores in the UK (even if they're published, the international publishers don't pay for shelf space, so the games don't appear in stores). I've never heard of an publisher of this type before having an e-store but no download facility, and it's making it impossible for me to purchase any of these games. Is this planned at any point?

hyphz wrote:I'm very interested in a number of matrixgames products, but why the refusal to offer a download service, nor any shipment methods other than the most expensive option available? As it is, a $30 game costs me $72.94. If I want KP, that's $92.94, plus a restock wait. The vast majority of these games will never appear in stores in the UK (even if they're published, the international publishers don't pay for shelf space, so the games don't appear in stores). I've never heard of an publisher of this type before having an e-store but no download facility, and it's making it impossible for me to purchase any of these games. Is this planned at any point?

www.justplaynow.com The company is based in the UK.

There you can find KP for 29.99£ (price includes shipping within UK)

Just Play has published four Matrix games so far and they make their own euro versions. So you can buy the games....

And there is one other option available, friends on the opposite side of the water . Or in some cases border.

Sending commercial mail is seldom easy I guess. What is common in one country might not be common in another.

I have to date only experienced confused frustration or lack of experience when dealing with persons living in Europe.

I for instance have sent simple cds containing lots of commonly downloadable free files to persons in foreign locations. The most significant being the Steel Panthers core program (at several hundred megs that a large file for people not lucky to have a broadband connection).

Here in Canada, it is as easy as buying a Postal Money order to send money to some distant location. A Postal Money order is genuine cash, but it is not actual currency. It is trackable secure and reliable. A person in the US has much the same ease of sending funds. You smply go to the post office and state you want a specific indivdual sent X dollars.

But this appears to be either not common in Europe, or some European countries are just not capable of it. It is also possible Europeans don't casually understand the value of doing this perhaps.

Different countries requiring differing solutions.

Matrix games though hasn't exactly been on the scene for the last 20 years though. So they are not able to say they have perfected getting their product to every spot on the globe 100%. But that is sure changing fast.
In 2002 you would have been lucky to see a Matrix Games product sitting on anyone's shelf let alone foreign ones.
By 2005 who knows, they might be a well recognised game name even in countries that seem distant.
But all this takes time.

Getting back to the friends comment though. If you can't get satisfaction with a local operation, then it is time to sit and contemplate unusual methods.
Always makes me chuckle that I seem to be posting this over and over. I have bought three items from online sources between 2002 and 2003. I bought all three of them through remote assistance. They were ordered through an online friend living in the US.
My cost to get the item, same cost to a US citizen plus 2 bucks.
It was not the costs that some are being frustrated over.
I incur currency differences of course 29.95 US is not 29.95 Canadian after all. But I have yet to pay for exotic shipping into Canada no customs, no additional expenses at all. I have only had to pay the cost to have a friend mail the item as personal mail from them to me.
In Canada and the US, a computer game (a cd in a jewel case) is not worth more than 5 bucks airmail even including the cost to purchase a cd mailer envelope.
That's of course a cd and jewel case only. Explains why a person has to be a bit fussy to want a manual that is not going to be read cover to cover like a novel, and likely will be consulted only a few times before being sent where all your other manulas were sent.

If you can't get a game into country X for a sane price, its time to make a good close friend at a place close to the source me thinks.

Of course so many wargamers are people that don't socialise well it seems

Hyphz. I was in a GAME store yesterday, and both Korsun Pocket (£29.99) and Titans of Steel (£24.99) are on sale now. They also sell Uncommon Valour. I haven't checked, but I would imagine that other UK retailers also stock these titles, and possibly others by Matrix. There's no need for expensive mail order.

And, what about us in the Middle East? Where do we go?

I for one, would prefer a 'Purchase as Download' option.

.Chris wrote:And, what about us in the Middle East? Where do we go?

I for one, would prefer a 'Purchase as Download' option.

The same place I told the other person to go to OR www.duchet.com

Chris I am unfamiliar with the Middle East where online service quality is concerned.

If your download was for a file that was 500 megs up to a full gig of data, what would the expense be to you to download that file?

Further to that, what would the cost of the download be, if say it failed part way through and you had to do it twice? (assuming that the sender would only charge once of course).

Here my service costs me 45 bucks a month, but that is based on a 5 gig upload 5 gig download max per month. So say I go a gig over budget, I just spent another 8 bucks on my service.

8 bucks is 8 bucks regardless of who gets it of course.

Being able to download a file is just an option, but not automatically a good one. And then you have to put it on a cd for safe keeping, so add the cost of a cd. And should you wish it, there is the cost to print out a manual (again should you wish it).

This is why I am not of the opinion myself personally, that being able to download a file is necessarily an option.

And people without broad band likely don't even consider it an option actually.

Well, where I'm at in Dubai, UAE, broadband is fairly spread out in the region. Also, broadband subscription's have already overtaken dial-up subscription's this year.

Btw, I'm on a 384kbps DSL line which costs $67 (unlimited dl/ul) a month. So, even *if* the download were to fail, it wouldn't cost me anything other than time.

The cost of a CD is negligible and a printed manual is something I'm willing to forego, rather than blowing almost the cost of the game itself on shipping, to get a manual.

Sure, not everyone is going to get buy as a download, but it'd sure help those not in a position to order CDs, like myself. Besides, if I were to order online, I'd have the game in a few hours for its original price (or less?), rather than waiting a few weeks for something that I would've spent almost twice as much to get.

I guess chris it comes down to number crunching then possibly.

You enjoy a healthy download option clearly. Me I can generally say my upload download never gets used up monthly (I think my average is like 3.5 gigs in a typical month).

I think we both agree on the manual requirement.

So that leaves it being a choice of if there are enough of you wishing to download to warrant the download option then it becomes something someone might consider viable (makes sense).

If not, then I suggest cultivating a good friendship in the US, someone that can order it and then remail it (because shipping costs from Matrix Games to a US resident really isn't much.

This concept works for me at least

Hi Hyphz

We are considering opening a warehouse in Europe and selling direct. We are waiting to see how well the games are selling in the stores and then see how we are going to conduct the releases of our next game.

David

David Heath wrote:Hi Hyphz

We are considering opening a warehouse in Europe and selling direct. We are waiting to see how well the games are selling in the stores and then see how we are going to conduct the releases of our next game.

David

David, I hope sales will go well.

A European Matrixgames warehouse would ROCK. :p

Could be the first step in David's plan to take over the world eh heheh

Blunderbuss wrote:Hyphz. I was in a GAME store yesterday, and both Korsun Pocket (£29.99) and Titans of Steel (£24.99) are on sale now. They also sell Uncommon Valour. I haven't checked, but I would imagine that other UK retailers also stock these titles, and possibly others by Matrix. There's no need for expensive mail order.

Thing is, I know that these games have been published. The problem is that GAME, like an awful lot of stores, simply won't put them on shelves as long as Just Play aren't paying through the nose for shelf space (which I can certainly understand they wouldn't want to). They use the space for the ones who did pay, and fill up with old stock for sale.

F'rinstance, I did see Titans of Steel in GAME. But it was only in one GAME store in town (the one in the worse location), was on a carousel stand facing the opposite direction to the entrance, and they only had 3 copies. (Which, by the way, sold out in 2 days.)

I did buy Titans of Steel; KP wasn't there, but I've mail ordered it from Just Play (who seem to mysteriously change their name to Just Flight when you order from them.. um, ok). It's just that I've seen waay too many independant/special market game producers and companies get burned as a result of this throttle in retail (just ask the author of Spheres of Chaos what happened to him) that I'm nearly convinced that retail-only no-download is just not an efficient option for them. But then, I can't really claim to know about the business end, so I'll shut up know.

Belisarius wrote:David, I hope sales will go well.

A European Matrixgames warehouse would ROCK. :p

It would allow me to order directly from Matrix. Battlefront did this some time ago (European warehouse) which meant I could order directly from them, not pay a big shipping cost PLUS that fact that it ships within the EU removes the risk of paying taxes which I had to do when UV was shipped to me from the USA.

U2 wrote:It would allow me to order directly from Matrix. Battlefront did this some time ago (European warehouse) which meant I could order directly from them, not pay a big shipping cost PLUS that fact that it ships within the EU removes the risk of paying taxes which I had to do when UV was shipped to me from the USA.

Yeah, I bought a game from Battlefront, and it was shipped from Ireland (shipping cost $7). Having said that, I actually still prefer to buy from high street stores. I like browsing among the titles and comparing prices between stores. This is how I've bought my games for the last twenty-odd years. Old habits die hard. It's a form of gentle exercise, as well!

Hyphz. I'm fortunate as far as GAME stores go. There are three of them in Newcastle (within a couple of hundred yards of each other!) and one in the Metrocentre. There are also numerous other games stores in this area. A CHIPS store has recently opened in Consett. This is the first dedicated games shop we've ever had! Videogaming must be really popular at the moment.

Personally I like the idea of online downloads. If someone could come up with a foolproof method I think this could quickly become world's best practise.

Brubaker

Good topic hyphz. IMO, all this babble about wanting a download option is quite beside the point.

All a person has to do is visit two of the other online wargame retailers to see the difference between them and this place.

A visit to either Battlefront.com (http://www.battlefront.com/index.htm)or HPS (http://www.hpssims.com/) will reveal that both of these *successful* online retailers will ship anywhere in the USA for about $7-8, to Canada for about a buck more and to the rest of the world for about $11.
Now, that $11 oversees shipping cost is more than likely surface mail, which would probably take a month, not some overnight thing, but those are the breaks. If someone wants it overnight, well then it's their option to pay through the nose for it - more power to them.

Furthermore, both of these companies have their various shipping costs clearly stated *before* you get to check out, unlike this place. Here, you don't find out about the $66 shipping cost to your hut in Botswana, Africa until you get to the cash register.

Of course, both of these companies use the USPS, instead of some "private" golddigging shipper.

In my opinion, if a company wants to look good and not come off as screwing their customers, then the standard shipping method should be a combination of the cheapest and the most used, instead of automatic $50+ overnight rates.

Strategycat you don't like the forums you don't like the service you don't like the shipping, is there anything you do like, and if not, while do you insist on coming here?

In my opinion, if a company wants to look good and not come off as screwing their customers, then the standard shipping method should be a combination of the cheapest and the most used, instead of automatic $50+ overnight rates.

We´re not screwing anybody here. All of our games are available via retailers on the respective continents.

I could blame EB Games for screwing me since they are still checking my Credit Card information (since 1.5 weeks now). I could of course also order the european versions of the respective games, but I want the Us versions, so I wait, since its a normal procedure.

A visit to either Battlefront.com (http://www.battlefront.com/index.htm)or HPS (http://www.hpssims.com/) will reveal that both of these *successful* online retailers will ship anywhere in the USA for about $7-8, to Canada for about a buck more and to the rest of the world for about $11.

Our shipping and handling is $8.95 and you get a trackable shipment that protects both us and you. We also offer phone orders that neither battlefront or HPS offer as far as we can tell. We also offer our products through retail which HPS does not do. Or you can get them through online distributors. So you have a full range of choices to get our games. At retail with no shipping, via a local distributor with lower shipping, or direct through us.

Furthermore, both of these companies have their various shipping costs clearly stated *before* you get to check out, unlike this place. Here, you don't find out about the $66 shipping cost to your hut in Botswana, Africa until you get to the cash register.

Actually its battlefornt that doesn't calculate your shipping charge until you "proceed to check out". If you hit "Africa" in the calculate your shipping section of "your shopping cart" you will see the 65.95 cost of shipping before you even check out.

USPS only gets the package to the country, the local postal system takes it from there. A guy in a UPS truck delievers our package to your hut in Botswana. And you can track it if it doesn't show up. How often do Botswanan mail carriers visit your hut? And if it never shows up? Hopefully you used one of those platinum cards that eat the chargeback...

Your implication that you don't see the shipping cost until AFTER you check out is simply untrue. You see it and can choose among options right from the shopping cart before you even get to the screen that asks for your credit card.

If you want to bitch - feel free. But please don't misrepresent our operation in doing so.