Matrix Games Forums

I'm playing a modified scenario 19 of my own doing saved in slot 22 & some of my Aussie units are not upgrading like they should. My Hudsons & Beauforts are not upgrading to Beaufighters like they should. There are plenty of Beaufighters in pool & my US units have been upgrading fine. Did something change in the last patch that I missed or is this an error that has come about?
One other thing I've found is that scout groups on BB/CA/CL that are sunk are at some point reconstituted as new land groups even though they went down with the ship. Even though I don't really mind having the patrol planes, I think they should be lost forever with the ship unless they make it to land which I don't see the a/c redirecting message like you would when a carrier is highly damaged or sunk.

I believe that the upgrade paths were changed when the Beaufighter was made a fighter-bomber in one of the patches, and that Beauforts and Hudsons no longer upgrade to Beaufighters.
--Dave

I can only confirm what Dave said: Beaufort and Hudson no longer upgrade to Beaufighter in UV v2.30 but can't remember wich patch change that.

Bummer [:(] , guess I'm gonna have to change some later arriving units over to BF to get some into action. Some of the changes I've done have added SpitVIII to a couple of units to see how well they do & they seem to do very well having a 30:1 kill rate, SpitV only a 5:1. Will be trying the P51's & 47D to see what they come up with. Corsairs & Hellcats do rather well having a 10-20:1 kill rate with the Buffalo & Wildcat at about even.

I wouldn't be so worried if i were you. Beauforts are the best medium bomber antishiping weapon in the Allied arsenal. They'll put holes in IJN ships, transport or combat, which will then be much more easily hit by numerous level bombers. Hudsons on the other hand are excellent addition to your Catalinas in naval search misions in early months when it is essencial to know IJN whereabouts. You don't want an invasion fleet sighted for the first time some 3 hexes off Brisbane, now don't you? Recon hard, strike harder. Don't die. Cheers to Aussies then and RAAF. Bloody good planes, both of them. Gamewise at least...

Any Idea to what plane the Hudson/Beaufort upgrade to ?

Looks like nothing unless you have an old unpatched version of UV.

Yes, the beauforts are very valuable. Much more deadly than the avenger due to the superior torpedo. Hudsons are invaluable as well-if a bit fragile.

ORIGINAL: jcjordan

Some of the changes I've done have added SpitVIII to a couple of units to see how well they do & they seem to do very well having a 30:1 kill rate, SpitV only a 5:1. Corsairs & Hellcats do rather well having a 10-20:1 kill rate with the Buffalo & Wildcat at about even.

30:1 kill ratio??? What are you arming those things with air-to-air missiles?

Shocked me too but it's only a test scenario using the tutorial. I made all the experience & morale the same for each unit then try them for 1mo on sweep & 1mo on cap. Of the ones tested the Spit8 has come out the best with the Corsair-1 second, Hellcats close third.

ORIGINAL: DaveConn

I believe that the upgrade paths were changed when the Beaufighter was made a fighter-bomber in one of the patches, and that Beauforts and Hudsons no longer upgrade to Beaufighters.
--Dave

The patch concerned was V2.2 and the update file clearly states

10) Updated weapons choice, long range capability and artificial intelligence code to reflect change of Beaufighter to fighter-bomber.
11) Beaufort and Hudson no longer upgrade to Beaufigter.

This change was a good thing as historically, no RAAF squadron upgraded from the Beaufort/Hudson to the Beaufighter. In game terms, you found the computer invariably upgraded all your Beaufort squadrons to Beaufighters on the first turn leaving you with a force structure that bore no resemblence to historical reality.

The RAAF strategic planning* clearly seperates the category of long range fighters (Beaufighters) from torpedo bombers (Beauforts). Hudsons were classified as General Reconnisance bombers. The plan was constantly updated due to the current state of new aircraft availability but at Febuary 1943 the plan was for 30 Squadrons containing two squadrons of British built L.R. fighters and one torpedo bomber squadron. By Dec '43 with Beaufort production in full swing and local Beaufighter production commencing, these figures were expected to be four and five respectively out of a total force of 45 squadrons.

As it turned out these targets were overtaken by circumstances (like the delays in local Beaufighter production) but it does illustrate that the Beaufort/Beaufighter upgrade path was inappropriate. Hudsons were purchased as an interim measure due to delays in the local Beaufort production and numbers were reduced as Beauforts became available. The Beaufort remained in production for the period of UVand remained in front line service for the remainder of the war.

Some of the changes I've done have added SpitVIII to a couple of units to see how well they do & they seem to do very well having a 30:1 kill rate, SpitV only a 5:1.

Looks like we have a bit of a play balance issue here. The trouble is that there is only one squadron (No. 79 Squadron RAAF) equipped with the Spitfire in this theatre and there are few instances of air to air combat to base statistics on and the single squadron probably did not justify much game play balance testing. By the way, the aircraft used during the UV time period were Spitfire Vc aircraft as No.s 79, 452 and 457 Squadrons only began re-equipping with the Spitfire MkVIII from April 1944.

Gamewise, I think the Beauforts may also be a bit over rated compared to contemporary accounts but due the the sterling work they did achieve historically and their relatively small numbers in the game (as compared to the USN types), I do not feel that this detracts from the game.

You must accept a game of this type will have minor inaccuracies but overall I feel this game hits right on the mark for gameplay and historical feel.

(* Australia in the War of 1939-1945, Series Three - Air, Volume 1 - Royal Australian Air Force 1939-42, Douglas Gillison, Australian War Memorial, Canberra, 1962, p706.)