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Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:47 pm
by Von Rom
The A&E movie about Eisenhower was shown last night.
Has anyone seen it? It should be on several more times this week if you missed it.
Overall, the movie was good. I gained a better appreciation of the enormous pressures that faced the Supreme Commander before D-Day. Selleck, although he doesn't look much like Ike, does give a good performance. Even so, I always felt as though Selleck as Ike, has far more on-screen charisma than I think Eisenhower had.
Still, the film shows the very tough balancing act that Ike had to play between the competing personalties.
I thought that Monty, Churchill and De Gaulle were captured quite well.
However, I was upset at the way Patton was portrayed in the film. The actor portraying him looked soft and pasty-faced and acted like a wimpering child. Patton may have been a lot of things, but I think the portrayal of him in this movie does him a great disservice.
What did you think of the movie?
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:05 pm
by mavraam
I liked it.
I thought the best parts were the personal, one on one conversations, especially with Churchill.
I too am skeptical of the conversation with Patton. I find it hard to believe he would behave that way. Still, I'm quite sure Patton would do anything to not get sent home. His greatest fear was that he would never get a chance to fight a great battle.
I wonder how accurate they were. I would be especially interested in knowing if Churchill ever said to Ike, "From this point forward, we're in this thing together. If it fails, we both go down together"
But overall I think it did a great job of capturing the sheer gravity and agony of the decisionmaking that went into this massive gamble.
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:37 pm
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: mavraam
I liked it.
I thought the best parts were the personal, one on one conversations, especially with Churchill.
I too am skeptical of the conversation with Patton. I find it hard to believe he would behave that way. Still, I'm quite sure Patton would do anything to not get sent home. His greatest fear was that he would never get a chance to fight a great battle.
I wonder how accurate they were. I would be especially interested in knowing if Churchill ever said to Ike, "From this point forward, we're in this thing together. If it fails, we both go down together"
But overall I think it did a great job of capturing the sheer gravity and agony of the decisionmaking that went into this massive gamble.
At the beginning of the movie, it didn't state that the words spoken by the actors were actual converstaions, so it's hard to tell what was placed in the movie by the writer.
Overall, it does show the tremendous pressure Ike was under - the first film I have seen that details this. The movie is certainly worth seeing.
De Gaulle sure doesn't come off well, and seems to show what he was like from what I have read about him during his stay in England at the time.
Interesting when Ike meets with De Gaulle, Ike says: "The Vichy Government is the enemy. But they will be treated as Allies and will be liberated."
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:46 pm
by mavraam
Interesting when Ike meets with De Gaulle, Ike says: "The Vichy Government is the enemy. But they will be treated as Allies and will be liberated."
Its interesting that Ike tended to be diplomatic at first but when pressed, he had no problem stating something that boldly and directly! Also of note was his remark to Monty after his crack during the film about a quick thrust to Berlin (again). I don't remember the exact wording, but in effect he said "The broad front issue is decided. Let's not visit it again!" And that was that.
I don't know if Selleck's Ike was accurate, I just don't know enough about the man. But I really liked the character and I hope Ike was like that!
I do know a bit more about Churchill though having read a biography about him that was thicker than the Old Testament, and I would say the portrayal of him seemed quite accurate to me. A brilliant man who was an expert in both the military and politics and a man of great personal conviction and belief in the rightness of his cause. He also tended to be a great judge of character when it came to choosing people. If he liked you for the job, you were probably a very good choice.
So one could conclude, if they got Churchill right, and Monty, and De Gaulle, they probably got Ike right as well.
But tonight on A&E/History (not sure which) is a two hour docu on Ike. I'm looking forward to seeing how it compares.
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 6:44 pm
by marky
i loved it
i taped it of course
im a big fan of selleck. wen i was younger i watched magnum pi, but i dont know wat channel its on anymore.
i think selleck did a good job portraying ike
i do agree that patton would not act like that, tho i do agree that hed do just about anything to stay in the fight
i hated de gaulle. my exact words after watching him were - "wat a jerk, pompous french a@@hole"
of course that may not be politically correct, but if i remember right, de gaulle did act like a baby, and they showed that in the movie pretty well
5 out of 5 from me for this movie
and they did a nice job showing the amount of RAW PURE stress he was under
im gonnna watch it again tonite [:D]
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:24 pm
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: mavraam
Interesting when Ike meets with De Gaulle, Ike says: "The Vichy Government is the enemy. But they will be treated as Allies and will be liberated."
Its interesting that Ike tended to be diplomatic at first but when pressed, he had no problem stating something that boldly and directly! Also of note was his remark to Monty after his crack during the film about a quick thrust to Berlin (again). I don't remember the exact wording, but in effect he said "The broad front issue is decided. Let's not visit it again!" And that was that.
I don't know if Selleck's Ike was accurate, I just don't know enough about the man. But I really liked the character and I hope Ike was like that!
I do know a bit more about Churchill though having read a biography about him that was thicker than the Old Testament, and I would say the portrayal of him seemed quite accurate to me. A brilliant man who was an expert in both the military and politics and a man of great personal conviction and belief in the rightness of his cause. He also tended to be a great judge of character when it came to choosing people. If he liked you for the job, you were probably a very good choice.
So one could conclude, if they got Churchill right, and Monty, and De Gaulle, they probably got Ike right as well.
But tonight on A&E/History (not sure which) is a two hour docu on Ike. I'm looking forward to seeing how it compares.
They're showing the 2 hour bio on Ike tonight on A&E, and right after that the 2 hour movie again. Definitely worth watching
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:29 pm
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
i loved it
i taped it of course
im a big fan of selleck. wen i was younger i watched magnum pi, but i dont know wat channel its on anymore.
i think selleck did a good job portraying ike
i do agree that patton would not act like that, tho i do agree that hed do just about anything to stay in the fight
i hated de gaulle. my exact words after watching him were - "wat a jerk, pompous french a@@hole"
of course that may not be politically correct, but if i remember right, de gaulle did act like a baby, and they showed that in the movie pretty well
5 out of 5 from me for this movie
and they did a nice job showing the amount of RAW PURE stress he was under
im gonnna watch it again tonite [:D]
No doubt about it, Selleck is a good actor.
It's amazing with all the conflicting personalities, pressures, etc, etc, that Ike was able to pull it all together.
Goes to show that the position of "The Most Powerful Man in History" needed to be diplomatic and self-effacing. . .
I'd like to learn more about Ike and what happened during this time period before the invasion. It makes for interesting viewing.
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:14 pm
by VictorH
Excellent Show right down to Ike the Chain Smoker!
IN particular I was intrigued by the comments between Churchill and Ike at the beginning about the debate as to whether they should bomb Germany out of the war or invade. I really don't recall reading much about this debate and don't know if it actaully occurred to the degree aluded to in the show.
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 10:17 pm
by marky
his bio is on tv?
wat time wat channel lol [:D]
[&o]do u know?[&o]
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 5:14 am
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: VictorH
Excellent Show right down to Ike the Chain Smoker!
IN particular I was intrigued by the comments between Churchill and Ike at the beginning about the debate as to whether they should bomb Germany out of the war or invade. I really don't recall reading much about this debate and don't know if it actaully occurred to the degree aluded to in the show.
It is an interesting insight ito Allied strategy. I wonder how far the bombing campaign would have gone?
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 5:18 am
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
his bio is on tv?
wat time wat channel lol [:D]
[&o]do u know?[&o]
I think you missed it tonight. However, knowing A&E both Ike's bio and the movie will probably be repeated on the weekend. Check your TV guides [:)]
Now this is quality TV.
The two hour bio of Ike was quite interesting. I knew little about him. It was almost as if his entire life had been a preparation for what he would encounter in WWII. He was also friends with the other giants: Patton, MacArthur, etc. . .
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 5:58 am
by dinsdale
During the campaign DeGaulle and Leclerc threatened to disobey Eisenhower and march into Paris with or without his approval. I wonder what Patton would have done had he been Supreme Commander, and whether it would have been legal to hang them for mutiny
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:27 am
by marky
ORIGINAL: Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
his bio is on tv?
wat time wat channel lol [:D]
[&o]do u know?[&o]
I think you missed it tonight. However, knowing A&E both Ike's bio and the movie will probably be repeated on the weekend. Check your TV guides [:)]
Now this is quality TV.
The two hour bio of Ike was quite interesting. I knew little about him. It was almost as if his entire life had been a preparation for what he would encounter in WWII. He was also friends with the other giants: Patton, MacArthur, etc. . .
like it was his destiny to be supreme commander in europe
o, i just got done taping the bio on him- very interesting
now im taping the movie again lol
the bio mite b on again 1 last time tonite after the movie is over
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:32 am
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: dinsdale
During the campaign DeGaulle and Leclerc threatened to disobey Eisenhower and march into Paris with or without his approval. I wonder what Patton would have done had he been Supreme Commander, and whether it would have been legal to hang them for mutiny
Heheh
Funny, I was thinking the
same thing.
Imagine De Gaulle saying what he did to Ike, but saying it to Patton instead. Now that would have been an interesting exchange [:)]
I watched the movie again tonight, and still couldn't believe how De Gaulle talked to Ike. From what I understand the Allies had to let De Gaulle march into Paris with his French troops. This way, it looked like the French had done all the fighting to liberate Paris. [8|]
Makes you appreciate the difficulties encountered with the French authorities in the post-war world [;)]
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 6:38 am
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
ORIGINAL: Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
his bio is on tv?
wat time wat channel lol [:D]
[&o]do u know?[&o]
I think you missed it tonight. However, knowing A&E both Ike's bio and the movie will probably be repeated on the weekend. Check your TV guides [:)]
Now this is quality TV.
The two hour bio of Ike was quite interesting. I knew little about him. It was almost as if his entire life had been a preparation for what he would encounter in WWII. He was also friends with the other giants: Patton, MacArthur, etc. . .
like it was his destiny to be supreme commander in europe
I've read a lot of history. It makes you wonder sometimes. . .
In WWII, all the right people were in just the right positions. . .
Imagine anyone else but Ike as Supreme Commander. I wonder how anyone else would have handled all that pressure; all those difficult personalities. . .
Especially the way De Gaulle talked to him: it must have taken supreme self-control on Ike's part to let that all pass. . .
Even Churchill, in his biography by Martin Gilbert, mentions that on the night he became Prime Minister (May 10, 1940), he felt like he walking with Destiny, and that his entire life had been but a preparation for the momentous events he was about to face. . .
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:33 am
by Drex
Selleck did a good job portraying Ike. Ike seemed much more benign when he was President than when he was a general. You don't get to be 4 star by being a pushover. When he became President he was more of a delegator but still held the reins of government. The movie showed how good he was in difficult political/military situations. As far as Selleck goes, I still like him better as a cowboy.
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:27 pm
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: Drex
Selleck did a good job portraying Ike. Ike seemed much more benign when he was President than when he was a general. You don't get to be 4 star by being a pushover. When he became President he was more of a delegator but still held the reins of government. The movie showed how good he was in difficult political/military situations. As far as Selleck goes, I still like him better as a cowboy.
I think Ike was highly under-rated.
He surely knew how to play politics, and side-step those personality land-mines.
heheh
Selleck makes a good cowboy
Still, he is definitely coming into his own as an actor. . .
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:35 pm
by Von Rom
I must say though, that after watching both Ike's bio and the movie, I have gained a far better appreciation of both the man and the leader.
I see in Ike's handling of many of the problems he faced, especially with the personalties involved, a similar approach that Lincoln used, when he was president during the Civil War.
It was said of Lincoln after he died that "Here lies the most perfect ruler of men."
MacArthur once said that in reading about the lives of Washington and Lincoln, he had found all the answers he needed in dealing with the problems he faced as a leader.
I wonder if Ike had read the same books?
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:38 pm
by marky
and speaking of destiny
all the bomb plots that should have killed hitler, but DIDNT
seems it was everyones destiny to play a part, and let WW2, and history unfold as it did
ww1 and 2 created the modern world
and ww1 caused ww2
ww1 was caused by a gunshot, and ww2 (in europe) was pretty much ENDED by a gunshot
like Ike and selleck said - "its the little things...."
RE: Ike: Countdown to D-Day
Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:49 pm
by Von Rom
ORIGINAL: marky
and speaking of destiny
all the bomb plots that should have killed hitler, but DIDNT
seems it was everyones destiny to play a part, and let WW2, and history unfold as it did
ww1 and 2 created the modern world
and ww1 caused ww2
ww1 was caused by a gunshot, and ww2 (in europe) was pretty much ENDED by a gunshot
like Ike and selleck said - "its the little things...."
So true.
I certainly hope this movie is being shown in Europe.
At a time of power hungry dictators and leaders in WWII, here was "The Most Powerful Man in History" who used that self-effacing power and the armies under his command, to achieve a greater good.
It tends to place everything in perspective