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Okay, I've got another question about air combat. (Hey! I heard that groan!!! [:'(]) I've noticed that fighter vs. bomber aerial combat seems to be really short. It doesn't seem to matter if the bombers are escorted or not. (If anything, the attacks on the bombers seem to be shorter if there are no escorts.) If fighters are attacking/intercepting bombers and you blink, its over. Is this just me or is anyone else noticing this? Is it supposed to be this way?

Unless they are your bombers.
The AI Seems to have plenty of time to shoot yours down[:(]

ORIGINAL: dtravel

Okay, I've got another question about air combat. (Hey! I heard that groan!!! [:'(]) I've noticed that fighter vs. bomber aerial combat seems to be really short. It doesn't seem to matter if the bombers are escorted or not. (If anything, the attacks on the bombers seem to be shorter if there are no escorts.) If fighters are attacking/intercepting bombers and you blink, its over. Is this just me or is anyone else noticing this? Is it supposed to be this way?

My complaint is when your fighters outnumber the CAP by like 4:1 or more and they only engage like 2 or 3 of the CAP, and the rest of the CAP engage and shoot the hell out of your bombers.. I don't understand how out of 5 Buffalos, 2-3 avoid my 20+ zeros and attack the incoming bombers... Doesn't make sense when I have such a numerical superiority.

Xarun

At least for me, it doesn't matter if they are my bombers or the enemy's. ZIP! and they're past the fighters.

Sounds like no one has an explanation.

Is that Yamaha? I have 600 Fazer myself.[:D]

*bump*

I really think the fighter attack on bombers routines need to get looked at. I just had a group of unescorted Betty bombers get intercepted by my fighters. The fighters were set to 20,000 feet and the bombers dropped their bombs at 13,000 & 14,000 feet. The entire combat was:

Unit dives on bombers.
Unit climbs toward bombers.
Unit dives on bombers.
Unit climbs toward bombers.
Unit dives on bombers.
Air to air combat done.

Not a single bullet was fired. This is silly, dive-climb-dive-climb-dive and never fire against unescorted bombers? [:-] Not right.

ORIGINAL: dtravel

*bump*

I really think the fighter attack on bombers routines need to get looked at. I just had a group of unescorted Betty bombers get intercepted by my fighters. The fighters were set to 20,000 feet and the bombers dropped their bombs at 13,000 & 14,000 feet. The entire combat was:

Unit dives on bombers.
Unit climbs toward bombers.
Unit dives on bombers.
Unit climbs toward bombers.
Unit dives on bombers.
Air to air combat done.

Not a single bullet was fired. This is silly, dive-climb-dive-climb-dive and never fire against unescorted bombers? [:-] Not right.

Not sure about diving, but I know the routine takes into account climb rates for planes and planes with low climb rates too far below incoming planes will not be able to climb in time to catch them. My problem is that fighters seem to only want to engage bombers before they drop their load - once they bomb they are left alone to return home.. I think they should hit them before / during / after they drop their load.. Who cares if they have already dropped their load this time... A dead bomber can't come back...

Xargun

I understand the climb rate, but I wasn't getting "Unit's CAP dives" and "Unit climbs" messages. It was "Unit dives", "Unit climbs". Nothing to indicate that only the CAP was diving.

But even if it was just the CAP diving, why didn't they fire? It wasn't like they were going from 30K to the deck to engage.

Just my opinion, but I think something is either broken or off a bit in the routines controlling this kind of intercept.

Not sure, but I'm sure there is some random generator that determines how far away the CAP is from the bombers / base and calculates a chance they can catch them.. Most of the time you will get some combat (maybe no losses - but at least some attacks and damaged planes) and occaisonally you won't... If it happens a lot then it could be a problem... How many times does it have no attack at all ? Give us some more info.... What version ? New game or patched game ?

Xargun

Fighters on CAP can engage attacking aircraft "on the way home". You will see it where you get the "So and so is credited with Kill no #" messages after all combats have finished.

Apparently it's a die roll as to whether this special phase occurs. No doubt Betas could explain it a bit more ...

I have also seen a few air battles where the CAP seems to dive, then climb up to the bombers. It's rather weird. At first I thought it was one squadron diving and anotehr climbing up. But in most cases all my fighters were flying at the same altitude or close to (in all cases above the bombers).

Maybe this really is the actual CAP diving on the bombers and other fighters from the same squadron scrambling from the airfield and trying to climb and join the fight. I don't think those bombers are flying up and down faster then our fighters;-).

Marc aka Caran...

well, it happens to me always. but i fail to see a constant behaviour.

SOmetimes i send my bombers without escot and cap do nothing. but sometimes they kill a shitload of my bombers. Surely, most of the time you can attack without eascot and without problems.

i don't think it is related to the climb speed. I see the same thing happening when bombers bomb at 2000 or 5000 feets.

Xargun,

I think what you are seeing is the CAP having an Advantage, and doing a Hit and run attack. If the CAP has an Altitude advantage or Directional advantage they would be able to easily slip past the Fighters and hit the bombers. Also, Unless the Escort fighters have an edge, and are in position to intercept the CAP there is no reason for the CAP to Engage the Escort. The escort can make them hurry the attack and break off to keep them from attackng repeatedly, but, they will attack. Your example of Buffaloes versus Zeros is prime for this. If I was a Buff pilot, and I saw an escort of Zeros, I woudl not stay to fight. I woudl barrel in to the bombers, hit them and dis-engage. Throwing away your life and plane to get a FIghter kill is not very worhtwhile. If you go in and disrupt the bombers and they miss your field so you ca land, mission accomplished.

UB