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Leader Bug
Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 6:49 am
by Ron Saueracker
Nobody has answered my question. Why not just disable the auto leader routine and make it entirely manual? All the auto player aids should be disabled as none of them work anyway.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 7:18 am
by dtravel
Well, if nobody's using it anyways, why do they need to disable it?
I've never used auto leader and have lost more leaders than I can remember to this bug. From what Pry has said, there does not seem to be a single cause for losing leaders. He has apparently found two and is checking several more.
Besides which, a quick change to turn it off may not cause it to stop deleting leaders. (Assuming it is a cause.)
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 1:45 pm
by PeteG662
Send the save games to Pry and let him work it. He has a few of mone now and that is where he is finding things.......
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 7:05 pm
by witpqs
The displays on the leader screens need to be improved. It takes a long time clicking through each leader to find the ones with the appropriate skill (except surface fleet commander, there are plenty of them).
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 12:58 am
by testarossa
I have it off during TF set up, but somehow end up having a leader for TF selected by the AI. [&:]. And very often it is some kind of Lt. Mirakuma for US CV TF. I thought it was supposed to be fixed in 1.30?
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:00 am
by Tankerace
It was supposed to be fixed. For some reason, they (the testers, mods, and devs) can't reproduce the bug, but as soon as we get the software we break it [:D]
I don't know how true it is, but some people seem to think that it got worse since 1.3.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:09 am
by testarossa
Does the absence of betas and developers indicate the work on 1.40? Or they are just taking a break? And I've read here that 1.40 will be the last one?
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:16 am
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: testarossa
Does the absence of betas and developers indicate the work on 1.40? Or they are just taking a break? And I've read here that 1.40 will be the last one?
If 1.4 is the last one they either have no clue what they got into with a game the size of WITP or they sold you guys a half game for full price.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:17 am
by Tankerace
According to the "Exciting Update" thread, Mike Wood (the programmer) has to move on to other projects, and so 1.40 (As indicated by Kid in anoth thread) is the only definate forthcoming patch. So, unless they suddenly do a 180 and listen to the people that bought the product, any bugs that are left after 1.4 will simply become "undocumented features".
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:18 am
by Tankerace
ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker
If 1.4 is the last one they either have no clue what they got into with a game the size of WITP or they sold you guys a half game for full price.
Don't you mean a half game for
twice the normal price?
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:27 am
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: Tankerace
According to the "Exciting Update" thread, Mike Wood (the programmer) has to move on to other projects, and so 1.40 (As indicated by Kid in anoth thread) is the only definate forthcoming patch. So, unless they suddenly do a 180 and listen to the people that bought the product, any bugs that are left after 1.4 will simply become "undocumented features".
I think ONGOING PROJECTS WHICH PEOPLE SHELLED OUT A WHACK OF CASH FOR are more important than lining their pockets with forthcoming projects. Cart before the horse people. Economic morality compells those who started this and reaped cash (no matter how small the amount) to finish it. The game is incomplete. People did not purposely buy a half game for 80-100 bucks!
Where the hell are those responsible for this mess? If you guys think this game is playable and complete you are sadly out of line. I can't remember how many times this was brought up in the dev forums and nothing was done then and still nothing. I'm becoming embarrassed for helping and will be if this is the case.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:28 am
by fbastos
If 1.4 proves to be the last major update and they don't open the door for support from the community, I'm going to be really pissed off and will never again buy anything from Matrix.
It's not for the money, but for the time and dedication I've spent with the product, up so far.
F.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:07 am
by von Murrin
Geez, I know how you guys feel, but everything mentioned so far as regards patches and such is speculation. The way I read that landmark post was that 1.4 would be the last FEATURE patch. IOW, Matrix and 2by3 would still fix bugs but not add new stuff.[:)]
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:12 am
by Tankerace
Not if there is no programmer... It also said that Mike Wood had to move on to other projects. If there is no one to mess with the code, there is no one to fix the bugs.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 2:55 am
by fbastos
Geez, I know how you guys feel, but everything mentioned so far as regards patches and such is speculation. The way I read that landmark post was that 1.4 would be the last FEATURE patch. IOW, Matrix and 2by3 would still fix bugs but not add new stuff.
I can see them fixing bugs, but at the same time there are severe problems with the model that can only be addressed by rethinking parts of it. Some of it can be addressed on the OOB by heroes like Pry, but for other stuff we need a programmer working on the code.
While I understand the economics of such commitment (and I am willing to pay for maintenance), at the same time I'm not willing to see 2by3 cut and run and just leave us with whatever problems the game engine may have - especially so soon after it was launched.
As I write this, I realize I demand too much from a game; I just bought Vampire the Masquerade and really don't care if its developer will support it or not. I just intend to play it once and that's it. But then the vampire doesn't require nearly the same amount of dedication and commitment to play; for my commitment to WiTP, I do require total commitment from the developers.
F.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:25 am
by worr
So some are loosing leaders to automatic convoy routines?
So if you do yours manually you cannot loose a leader?
Worr, out
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:46 am
by Tankerace
I don't use automatic convoy, and I still loose leaders. Like dtravel said (it may have been in another thread), if you breathe while playing witp it can cause you to lose a leader.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 4:49 am
by ADavidB
ORIGINAL: worr
So some are loosing leaders to automatic convoy routines?
So if you do yours manually you cannot loose a leader?
Worr, out
I never use automatic convoys, and I see weird and wonderful (and very bizarre) leaders popping up on their own fairly regularly. However, I haven't been able to see much effect from the various leaders (this is nothing at all like it was in Pacwar), so I'm not really certain it makes any difference.
Dave Baranyi
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:46 am
by von Murrin
ORIGINAL: fbastos
Geez, I know how you guys feel, but everything mentioned so far as regards patches and such is speculation. The way I read that landmark post was that 1.4 would be the last FEATURE patch. IOW, Matrix and 2by3 would still fix bugs but not add new stuff.
I can see them fixing bugs, but at the same time there are severe problems with the model that can only be addressed by rethinking parts of it. Some of it can be addressed on the OOB by heroes like Pry, but for other stuff we need a programmer working on the code.
While I understand the economics of such commitment (and I am willing to pay for maintenance), at the same time I'm not willing to see 2by3 cut and run and just leave us with whatever problems the game engine may have - especially so soon after it was launched.
As I write this, I realize I demand too much from a game; I just bought Vampire the Masquerade and really don't care if its developer will support it or not. I just intend to play it once and that's it. But then the vampire doesn't require nearly the same amount of dedication and commitment to play; for my commitment to WiTP, I do require total commitment from the developers.
F.
WITP was and is a dream project, so I really do see certain members of the community eventually getting some hands in the pie. Heck, even Paradox's EU2 is on the verge of getting a community built map-hack program, with the full knowledge and possibly some assistance from lead programmer Johan. Ultimately, dev teams have to do what gets them money and we as gamers must render what solutions we can or might be given. Sure, from the POV of a purist, this will likely be far from ideal, but such is the reality of the business.
As for Bloodlines, I think it a wonderful game (haven't played much else, really). The big catch is whether or not Activision will play ball by allowing Troika sufficient patching time and ultimately the release of an SDK. One can only hope, given the potential strength of its mod community.
RE: Leader Bug
Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:05 am
by Ron Saueracker
ORIGINAL: von Murrin
ORIGINAL: fbastos
Geez, I know how you guys feel, but everything mentioned so far as regards patches and such is speculation. The way I read that landmark post was that 1.4 would be the last FEATURE patch. IOW, Matrix and 2by3 would still fix bugs but not add new stuff.
I can see them fixing bugs, but at the same time there are severe problems with the model that can only be addressed by rethinking parts of it. Some of it can be addressed on the OOB by heroes like Pry, but for other stuff we need a programmer working on the code.
While I understand the economics of such commitment (and I am willing to pay for maintenance), at the same time I'm not willing to see 2by3 cut and run and just leave us with whatever problems the game engine may have - especially so soon after it was launched.
As I write this, I realize I demand too much from a game; I just bought Vampire the Masquerade and really don't care if its developer will support it or not. I just intend to play it once and that's it. But then the vampire doesn't require nearly the same amount of dedication and commitment to play; for my commitment to WiTP, I do require total commitment from the developers.
F.
WITP was and is a dream project, so I really do see certain members of the community eventually getting some hands in the pie. Heck, even Paradox's EU2 is on the verge of getting a community built map-hack program, with the full knowledge and possibly some assistance from lead programmer Johan. Ultimately, dev teams have to do what gets them money and we as gamers must render what solutions we can or might be given. Sure, from the POV of a purist, this will likely be far from ideal, but such is the reality of the business.
As for Bloodlines, I think it a wonderful game (haven't played much else, really). The big catch is whether or not Activision will play ball by allowing Troika sufficient patching time and ultimately the release of an SDK. One can only hope, given the potential strength of its mod community.
I have had it up to my nostril hair with with the "after all it's a business, that's why support must end." No Shite. No prob there. I have a prob when the same theory does not apply to releasing a finished product. Does anyone here think this is a finished product worthy of being released and is good value?