Matrix Games Forums

Several people have asked for them, and I originally said no. However, I have decided that in a new scenario, I will include 3 "Never" Never Weres, the British G3, the Japanese Kii, and the American South Dakota 18inch class.

They are in the databases of all WPO scenarios, but are only in a special version of the 1926 campaign. This way, players can play with or without them, and I can make all parties happy. So:


The British G3, or Invincible class HMS Trafalgar. Since historians have not completely agreed on what their names would have been, I will use a blend, using Invincible, Indefatigeable, Trafalgar, and St. Andrew.

856 feet long, these battlecruisers have 9 16" guns and 16 6 inch guns. The only battlecruisers more powerful are the Japanese Amagis.


The 18 inch gunned South Dakotas. In the "Never" never were scenario, the first three SoDaks are the Cage masted 16inch gunned versions, while the later three are in this configuration. This design represents the design to switch out the 12 16" for 8 18", plus the rumored possibility that the SoDaks would have been completed with tripods, especially the latter ones.

The Kii class are identical to the Amagis, though their armor is on the scale of the Tosas and they are capable of 29 knots.

The orginal five WPO scenarios/campaigns have these ships in the OOB, but the ships are not included, and the 18inch SoDaks arrive as 16inch gunned SoDaks.

Hi,

Great stuff Tankerace!!! But, shouldn't the 18 inch SoDak's show mounts of 2 instead of 3 ?? Sorry for nitpicking.............

Rob.

hahahahhaha.....oops.

Fixed.

Do you happen to have the arrival dates for those ships handy? Are those dates based on specific sources or some kind of 'guesstimates' with respect to shipyard allocation a.s.o., somewhere between the ~3yrs for Nagato and 4yrs for Yamato?

Did you add all four planned Kiis?

Did you also consider to add the later 'Number 13' BC/fast BB, or is was it to much concept? Link: IJN Battleships

Edit: Found some more info on Project 13: Link: Steelnavy - Project 13 (modelling! a Link: Plan

Four battleships of unprecedented size and strength, designed by Admiral Hiraga, who had designed the Nagato Class. These four, designated numbers 13 through 16, were to be 915 feet long and displace 47,500 tons normal load. With a machine plant producing 150,000 shp, they would be capable of 30 knot speed. They designed to mount eight eighteen-inch/45 guns with a secondary of 16 5.5-inch/50 in casemates and four 5-inch AA guns in open mounts. Lastly they were to be equipped with eight 24-inch above water torpedo tubes in fixed positions in the hull. They were to be laid down in 1922 and completed in 1927.

The arrival dates are:

Kii and Owari to start in 1926 Super Dreadnought scenario. (May 1926)
All G3s are completed by the time they arrive in 1929.
SoDak arrival dates are:

South Dakota February 1926
Indiana March 1927
Montana March 1927 (Is a SoDak 18 inch in Super Dreadnought Scen)
North Carolina November 1925
Iowa January 1928 (Is a SoDak 18inch in Super Dreadnought Scen)
Massachusetts January 1928 (Is a SoDak 18inch in Super Dreadnought Scen)

They are based on rough "guestimations" based on how long comparative dreadnoughts took to build, state of completion in 1922, etc.
Nos. 11 and 12, the final 2 Kiis, are not included. I decided that on Never were designs, I would only include those ships that 1) could be completed by 1930, 2) had a finalized design by 1922-23, 3) Were named or a set of names had been given, and 4) had the Washington Treaty not been signed, the ships would have been completed.

I figured that Number 13 would completed late, and as it was a project didn't meet my "criteria" to be included.

I like it! I especially like the G3s.. I've heard several people refer to them as "1920's Iowas"...

I'll be buying your work, kudos to you. [:)]

This has tipped the scales for me -looks like I too will have to buy this game.

Is there any reason that you didn't include the British N3s ? Not having played WitP can additional ship types be added later by mere intelligent mortals or does it require an official patch from on high?

Whatever the answer subject to Domestic Chief of Staff approval (or failing that subterfuge) I will definitely getting the game.

Red Lancer

P.S. As an orbat junkie and kit spotter is any chance of a list of all the ship and aircraft types in the game?

That would be a HUGE list, even for WPO, which has a substantially smaller list of aircraft than WitP.

ORIGINAL: Tankerace

Hi Tanker,

I believe, the MOUNT for heavy guns should by 2 instead 3.

It's already been mentioned earlier in the thread.

I plan on adding the N3's anyway - although I'm not sure they meet Tankerace's criteria fully: would they have been ready in time?

Oooh, I can't wait for my Christmas Bonus so I can buy this!

Steve.

Actually, I may (read may) do some fun stuff later, and go "hog wild" with the various Japanese and British plans, and add in all of Tillman's projects. Wouldn't be realistic, but it would be fun! [:D]

Even though these are Alnavco models:


BB-1923, a SoDak with 12 18inchers


BB-1922, a SoDak with 8 18inchers (this is the Tillman in WPO)


The Tillman IV-2 design, a 1917 plan for a BB with 15 18inch guns.


The BB1917 design, basically a Colorado with a fifth turret.


The Japanese No. 13 with 8 18inch guns.

So, these may yet make it into WPO, but Definately not for the first release (which is this week).

Nice pics, but I thought I would include the 21 Sodak BB-49. It were, just was not finished. 12 - 16" guns were planned for this ships of this class.

She (Like Tosas, Amagis, Kiies, G3s, and last three Hoods are already in the game).

The South Dakotas come in 2 flavors. In all but the "Super Dreadnought" scenarios they have 12 16inch guns, in the Super Dreadnought the first three have 12 16inch, the last three eight 18inch.

The pics above were ships I may add, not that are already in.