Matrix Games Forums

[:D]

Actually they are a good way to learn the economic side of things I've found, as that's pretty much all they do until someone attacks or they have an army worth using.

I'm at the end of 1807 and have beaten Austria once. Unfortunately, their armies are all stuck in my territory foraging, and they won't accept a free passage treaty to let them out. [8|] I demanded a bunch of ceded provinces, including Karlsburg. Do you know what happened the turn before the treaty went into affect? Dang Russia sent Austria a liberation treaty for Karlsburg!! Is the AI really that sneaky? Now I've got to conquer Karlsburg..... [:@]

Supply is a big problem as far as I can tell...and maybe a bug unless I misunderstand something. Open a new game as Turkey, place a depot in Constantinople, move all but one army out of the province, and set *ALL* armies and divisions to forage. Then run the turn and look at the supply report. The units in the province with the depot are Supplied no matter what the setting is on the unit (and no, I'm not confusing garrisons). This sucks, because depots appear to be the only way I could get reinforcements to flow into Turkish units.

I used Ralegh's guide to setup Turkey, with some changes. First, I immediately set the Feudal level down to 50. It will take a while for this to adjust and happiness can go really bad some months. However, it is a step in the right direction. The big adjustments can come after you go Empire (which you don't want to do the first time it comes up). I turned taxes down to 8 to counterbalance the feudal hit somewhat.

Second, his draft age and training time I used exactly, but I set the draft level to 10 instead of maximum. By the end of 1805, I was starting to see some pretty good troops coming in as replacements. Most of my infantry units were up to a morale of six-ish by the time I fought Austria. New units were coming in with comparable morale to other nations too.

Economically, Turkey is only really short of wine. Maxing labor allocations gives her a huge amount of textiles, spice and luxuries (which helps keep population happy). She also makes plenty of food and reproduces enough to support the draft level with no worries. I traded for some wine, but there still just really isn't enough to go around. Fortunately, the huge quantities of textiles, spice and luxuries make up for not getting wine happiness boosts.

Sell cotton for big bucks. Britain and France both threw huge dollars at me for cotton trade. Since I could never figure out how wool and cotton turn into textiles, I forgot about hording them and shipped them off for dollars.

What does it mean when a protectorate has vertical and diagonal slashes in the province shading? I used a diplomatic option to make Algeria a protectorate and that's what they look like now. My other protectorates look normal. BTW, it appears there is a trigger on Tripolitania. I subsidized them to a pretty high (280+) attitude but no request for protectorate status was forthcoming. As soon as I declared war on Cyrenaica, up popped a diplomatic option to make it a protectorate.

Every so often, a bunch of infantry units get automatically put into my build queues. Is this a feudal levy or something? It's nice, because with the draft settings I have, they all come out as 4.7+ morale units. I don't have any advisors on, BTW.

Going Empire is good for Turkey once they have a few more protectorates or conquered provinces in North Africa to keep them above the empire score. Happiness just shoots through the moon once you do that (which makes reducing those feudal levels much easier). If you do it too soon, I can assure you from hard experience that losing empire status will ruin you. I think there were more revolt units than my own units before I quit that game.

Random thoughts from my weekend.....I do hope someone will check out that supply issue above, or correct my understanding of how it works.

Good on you Mynok! Turkey is a challenge, and I am glad if my notes helped a little.

Supply is a big problem as far as I can tell...and maybe a bug unless I misunderstand something. Open a new game as Turkey, place a depot in Constantinople, move all but one army out of the province, and set *ALL* armies and divisions to forage. Then run the turn and look at the supply report. The units in the province with the depot are Supplied no matter what the setting is on the unit (and no, I'm not confusing garrisons). This sucks, because depots appear to be the only way I could get reinforcements to flow into Turkish units.

a) I tried your steps, and I agree that there is a bug here. I will raise it.
b) Reinforcements will flow into units without a depot AFAIK - what do you mean with this comment?

Second, his draft age and training time I used exactly, but I set the draft level to 10 instead of maximum. By the end of 1805, I was starting to see some pretty good troops coming in as replacements. Most of my infantry units were up to a morale of six-ish by the time I fought Austria. New units were coming in with comparable morale to other nations too.

You know, I'm starting to think that this is a problem. I too do the same thing regardless of what country I play and I never see any ill effects. So why WOULDNT you narrow the draft focus a bit and get better troops for free?

To me there should be a distinctive down-side to doing this. Otherwise, why make it an options at all? Just have it set to the 'good' levels and be done with it.

To be fair, perhaps there IS a reason not to do it, but I'll be damned if I can see one. I've never seen it make a difference in the number of replacements I see being doled out to my units. So if its a choice simply between lower morale guys and higher morale guys, its not really a choice....

I guess if you were a warmonger and spent your soldiers lives with no regard it could be an issue, but I would guess you would really need to be bloodthirsty.

I've never got any reinforcement reports for Turkish units unless there was a depot in the province they were in. That's the full extent of what I noticed. Without depots, I see foraging loss reports galore, but never reinforcements (this is within the home country..I rarely left it). Once I threw a depot into the province, the foraging loss reports went away for that army, the reinforcements started flowing, and the money started disappearing.

As for Uncle_Joe's issue, I will say that it surprised me a bit to see those high-morale troops arriving so quickly myself, since I set it to a 20 month training cycle. Don't know how the game makes those calculations. Seems to me maybe the training cycle isn't implemented quite right, because I went to war with Austria in August of 1806, which is exactly 11 months from the beginning of the game. Most of my regular Inf and Cav were 4 - 5 morale range. This was *solely* from replacing foraging losses with reinforcements, or the free feudal infantry that were built. All of the latter were coming in with morale levels in accordance with my training time.....even though that training time could not possibly have been completed yet.

There should probably be a pro-rated morale level based on training completed, and maybe a switch to set whether less-than-fully-trained troops should be drafted for reinforcements or not.

Well, if you assume that you are simply extending the training time of 'classes' already in existance, its quite possible to see the 20 months paying off earlier (ie, if there were classes nearing the end of their pre-set 12 month training, then extending it to 20 would pay off in 8 months).

But be that as it may, the fact remains that I havent seen any downside to doing this. It really blurs the lines between the nations once they all have 'good' troops coming in. I would expect that there would be many less replacements available when you are being much more 'picky', but I havent seen that to be the case (of course not knowing exactly what the parameters are for replacing troops etc doesnt help test it).

ORIGINAL: Uncle_Joe

Well, if you assume that you are simply extending the training time of 'classes' already in existance, its quite possible to see the 20 months paying off earlier (ie, if there were classes nearing the end of their pre-set 12 month training, then extending it to 20 would pay off in 8 months).

But be that as it may, the fact remains that I havent seen any downside to doing this. It really blurs the lines between the nations once they all have 'good' troops coming in. I would expect that there would be many less replacements available when you are being much more 'picky', but I havent seen that to be the case (of course not knowing exactly what the parameters are for replacing troops etc doesnt help test it).

The variance is not on the rate reinforcements replenish depleted divisions, but rather, the variance is with the level of strength gained for a population factor added to the reinforcement pool.

I shall make the size limit cutoff much more severe in the next patch!

Best I have done is come in third with Turkey. They are a fun country to play when first starting out. My only problem with them is having to trade for wine almost every month. When one of the other powers gets above 800 glory I just forget about going through that trade every month. Let them be good Muslims and abstain from strong drink.[:D]

I didn't find the lack of wine to be much of a problem, since it really only lessens the happiness increases. It does no harm otherwise. The huge quantities of textiles, spice and luxuries more than makes up for the lack of wine.

ORIGINAL: Mynok


I didn't find the lack of wine to be much of a problem, since it really only lessens the happiness increases. It does no harm otherwise. The huge quantities of textiles, spice and luxuries more than makes up for the lack of wine.

But I want my people to be happy (they are easier to control when they are drunk).