Matrix Games Forums

For both the new BOB and BTR, the plane lists just went to artwork this afternoon.

Didn't count the BoB aircraft- I'll get that to you later.

But for BTR: there are 97 Axis/Luftwaffe aircraft types, and for the Allies, there are 117 different a/c. We can always add more.

So that's a bit of good news I hope.

Best to all,

Jean-Claude

So does this mean that each unit can have multiple AC type, depending on delivery or will each unit be tied to one AC type with customisations ala your OBs for BTR?

Hi Everyone:

Another update:

In adddition to the above mentioned aircraft for BTR, add 32 aircraft types that are produceable, but not useable. In that they consume resources, are targetable, but are types not flown within the parameters of BTR itself. Their production resources are only convertable to useable types given time, circumstance, events or the whim and fancy of the powers that be.

For BoB:

32 RAF and 95 Axis (both Italian and Luftwaffe) aircraft went to artwork today.

Best to all,

Jean-Claude

ORIGINAL: JCL

Hi Everyone:

Another update:

In adddition to the above mentioned aircraft for BTR, add 32 aircraft types that are produceable, but not useable. In that they consume resources, are targetable, but are types not flown within the parameters of BTR itself. Their production resources are only convertable to useable types given time, circumstance, events or the whim and fancy of the powers that be.

For BoB:

32 RAF and 95 Axis (both Italian and Luftwaffe) aircraft went to artwork today.

Best to all,

Jean-Claude

Is there any penalty for not producing the unusable types? Why wouln't an Axis player just convert them all on day 1 to something useful (usable)?

Like the idea though!

Is there any penalty for not producing the unusable types? Why wouln't an Axis player just convert them all on day 1 to something useful (usable)?

Well, I would imagine that the grunts flying Ju 88 bombers, 188's, He 111's, 177's, Ju 87's, Ar 234 jets, Bf 109 Recce's and Trainers, Ju 52's, 252's, 352's, 290's, etc., would feel that their aircraft are useful! Plus the functions that these aircraft provided, probably bordered on the crucial in many instances.

I can hear Harley now, down under groaning, that you might get me started on some long winded disertation about the state of German industry, and what it could and couldn't produce, and why. Suffice to say that some of these aircraft, or better said, their production locations will eventually free up for you or the AI to convert to more useable types.

All the best,

Jean-Claude

ORIGINAL: JCL

Is there any penalty for not producing the unusable types? Why wouln't an Axis player just convert them all on day 1 to something useful (usable)?

Well, I would imagine that the grunts flying Ju 88 bombers, 188's, He 111's, 177's, Ju 87's, Ar 234 jets, Bf 109 Recce's and Trainers, Ju 52's, 252's, 352's, 290's, etc., would feel that their aircraft are useful! Plus the functions that these aircraft provided, probably bordered on the crucial in many instances.

I can hear Harley now, down under groaning, that you might get me started on some long winded disertation about the state of German industry, and what it could and couldn't produce, and why. Suffice to say that some of these aircraft, or better said, their production locations will eventually free up for you or the AI to convert to more useable types.

All the best,

Jean-Claude

Ah - got you, the game wont let you change them until a certain point! Will this be fixed time, or conditional. I think it should be conditional - LW strength below a threshold, or points score above a threshold (which could change with time). No point building HE177 when the LW fighters cant fly safely!

What I would like to see is some form of restriction on what site can build what efficiently. At present, if I wanted I could change all a/c fac to build 109g6 (say) on day one, and apart from the changeover penalty, that's it (the issues are more a function of aircraft type than factory). I would like Me factories to do 109s with no hassle (other than standard retooling), but FW factories to take longer, and be less efficient (politics, etc). All these production games hugely underestimate the inertia of industry, and the 'not invented here' effects. Hurri's in production to 1944 anyone? Ge 109 subvarient chaos? No 'god' player would run the industry as happened in history, and they need to be 'encouraged' to be less ruthlessly optimised! (I don't want anyone to be able to tend towards 1 day fighter, 1 NJG, 1 ZG type etc, without penalties!)

ORIGINAL: JCL

I can hear Harley now, down under groaning, that you might get me started on some long winded disertation about the state of German industry, and what it could and couldn't produce, and why. Suffice to say that some of these aircraft, or better said, their production locations will eventually free up for you or the AI to convert to more useable types.

All the best,

Jean-Claude

save the speil - this is one of the best innovations I have heard.

My arguments as to why cant you do this or that are NEVER based on any historical knowledge whatsoever, but are based on what I think is commonsense gameplay. This sort of thing is gameplay based (but historically driven), and adds to the experience of the game.

@Harley
There is oh God this old Australier still [:'(].I am implored out of the prison..
Happy new year.


V.

Will you be able to expand the Luftwaffe pilot training program, putting out more, or better pilots, maybe giving up some fuel?

what about maybe if the oil industry goes below a certain level than like a Critical Industry Level it begins to affect trg.

If the Oil level goes below such and such a level than German replacement pilots starting skill drops to reflect fule shortages and rationing among trg cadres.

As far as retooling industries. maybe putting leadership into the mix could help like in WITP. by changing leaders certain facets of industry are affected. For example putting willi messerchmitt in charge gives a bonus to Me 210 production of Eherd Milch reducing retooling time

what about maybe if the oil industry goes below a certain level than like a Critical Industry Level it begins to affect trg.

If the Oil level goes below such and such a level than German replacement pilots starting skill drops to reflect fule shortages and rationing among trg cadres.

only hassle with this kind of thing, is once the Allied player knows this will happen, they will target Oil or what not, sooner then normal

for training, there are ideas out there, we just got to see what can be done