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All right what am I doing wrong? My opponent "Helpless" has been very successful with his ASW operations from aircraft.

So far in our war (July 1926) I have had 3 submarines sunk by aircraft and 4 more damaged to some extent. Now obviously the majority of my float planes start the war unarmed and have to be converted but this seems like a high success rate.

We are playing with Sub Doctrine ON. Does the fault lie with the ASW routines or is the commander (ME). I am usually pretty aggressive with submarines but this is getting bad.

TankerAce how about a tutorial on sub ops and ASW[&o]

Have them run Naval Search instead of ASW Patrol, and you'll get some hits.

But make sure you "train them up" first ... I don't much use ASW mission ( maybe just a superstition from WITP .. but I sink lots of subs with Naval Search mission over there ) .. but training the patrol units up into the 80s may be the most important aspect. And they probably get more spots if running the Naval Search mission ... also the mission profile is important .. very low altitude and max range ( yes this is an anomoly - but it works in the game ). Also if you want max effectiveness assign a good patrol commander to the unit. Lilke as Japan ( in 1922 ) I start by assigning Fuchida ( a great Patrol Cdr as we all know! ) to the one FelixStowe unit at Tokyo ... and then sending these guys to the PI where they will get lots of spots ... ever spot increases their exp and once they start making attacks, then the exp goes up faster .. once they hit exp=80 they will start to be deadly ...

Heh! My sole Felixstowe chutai is the highest experience unit in my entire air force: 71 and climbing.

I've had trouble getting above 75 ... everytime I get there I suffer a flak loss and then if I add a newbie ... ( a 30 something if I'm lucky ) I drop back into the 60s and the process repeats ... so now I'm trying not replacing the loss ... if I get piles of the pilots into the 80s .. then maybe we'll try adding a newbie ..

But for 1922 the Felxistowe Chutai is pretty much the main game for my air farce ! They've hit piles of ships ( even the Monadnoc ) and piles of subs .. not clear that they are doing much damage .. but getting hits anyway !

I think I will move them off ASW Patrol and do Naval Search at 1000 feet. See how that works.

Most of my float plane detachments are in the 70's. It is only the fighters and bombers that have the bungling idiots in them:-)

Is there something wrong when you have more attacks and hits from Naval Search vs. ASW Combat?

Is there something wrong when you have more attacks and hits from Naval Search vs. ASW Combat

I can't see the code so I can't be sure .. but after about 2500 PBEM turns of WITP ... the majority of results I'm getting are with the Naval Search mission ... we do know that the ASW mission cuts the range down .. so even if you think you are flying 2 hexes you are really only flying 1 etc.

But I think whether an aircraft can hit subs and whether an aircraft hits them better under one mission or the other must depend on the ordnance normally carried by that aircraft.

For example in WITP, float planes ( like Jake ) seem to only get hits when flying ASW mission .. most other plane types ( 2 eng bombers for example ) get more hits when flying naval search.

Betty/Nell/Mavis/Emily almost never get hits ( on subs ) .. I assume this is because they want to carry torpedoes. But that being said .. Frances is a sub killer once they finally come in. But the primary sub killers ( for the Japanese ) in WITP are Helen and Sally ( Lily can get more hits, but they don't do as much damage ). Number of bombs seems to determine how many hits you get and weight of bombs seems to determine how much damage. So in WITP train your Sallys and Helens up to exp=80 and put them on max range at 1000 feet and watch the subs go glug ... is this right ? No. But this is the way it works ! In one of my games we made house rules against using Army bombers as sub killers ... but that was because they were just too effective.

In this game, aircraft will almost certainly not be too effective .. many less aircraft .. much less range .. smaller and fewer bombs .. but my default ( for patrol planes ) is naval search max range 1000 feet ... this will also get incidental hits against surface ships.

But if anyone figures out exactly when it is better to use ASW please post it - many of us would like to know !!!

Hmm.. in the example above, most of my plane were on ASW mission. They reached quite high experience already (~75). Together with good commander and luck it might give some exceptional results.


Just remember on WITP forum, there was info from Frag that planes on ASW can use DC , and on Naval search they do use bombs... not sure about that.. [&:]

DC vs. bombs. I wonder if TankerAce can confirm if they do in WPO.

My float planes are on ASW as well and seem to be attacking alot, but of course they are unarmed so does not do much[:D] Slowly but surely upgrading, but the replacement rate is so low it will take months.

The planes don't use DCs (I'm pretty sure). After all, only the Martin NBS-1 could even carry one... maybe a few of the torpedo bombers (weight wise, not in service wise). The Bombers and float planes can't though, the DCs just weigh too much.

I'd put on NavSearch, to make sure the planes load bombs. I'll bet in ASW search they find and strafe the subs, but don't drop anything.

I found the only way for my Felixstowe flying boats to attack subs was to put 'em on Naval Search.

As for DC it was for LB in WITP... but I'm not sure... of cause the in that sence WPO is all way different...

How we can differentiate when flying boat is strafing and when is bombing?

I got a plenty ASW attacks with Felixtowe planes from the same base. But I have both NS and ASW, and all of them seems to get experience from their mission. I have no idea how to find who is making ASW attacks.

If the aircraft gets hits on submarines, it is making ASW attacks !

[:)] ok..

.. but if there is several squadrons - some on ASW and some on NS. How to find who has scored and how (straffing, bombing)? They all have about the same amount of mission and fatigue..

ORIGINAL: Helpless

[:)] ok..

.. but if there is several squadrons - some on ASW and some on NS. How to find who has scored and how (straffing, bombing)? They all have about the same amount of mission and fatigue..

Well if they are all flying the same airplane type, then donno ... but not sure aircraft "strafe" submarines ... naval search and asw missions do not execute normal attack, they only execute "incidental" attack ... I "think" they use bombs ( which is why some types NEVER hit .. because they don't carry bombs or their bombs are too small .. but they will attack even if not carrying bombs, they just will not hit. ) But if you care that much, then move some of the squadrons so you only have 1 of each air type covering a given area, and then you can tell ( I never have enough planes to want to put very many in the same place .. I have too many places to cover .. and any coverage .. is much better than no coverage ! ).