Matrix Games Forums

Hi!

Working on my scenarion "The 4th Republic" and I'm trying to put a little twist in it but I'm having some problems. Perhaps one of youse veteran scenario designers can help me.

Here's the problem:

Using "Theater Option" I want to offer the player some choices at the beginning of the game. He will have "Theater Option A" or "Theater Option B." "Theater Option A" will be presented to him on Turn One. If he chooses this option things..[:)] will happen which may or may not be to his benefit. If he decides not to choose "Theater Option A" he then will be presented with "Theater Option B" on Turn 2 (and this option will remain for the rest of the game until he chooses it). The problem that I am having is that I can't figure out how to cancel "Theater Option A" if the player doesn't choose it.

Here's what I've done:

Event 1 is "Theater Option A." This works fine and delivers what the player asks for.

Event 2 - I've tried a "1 occupies" his own capital here with a delay of 1.

Event 3
Event Activated - Cancel Event - Activated 2
Delay 0 - Turn Range 1 - Cancel 1

Event 4 is "Theater Option B"

Unfortunately Event 3 does not cancel Event 1 and I'm left with both Theater Options for the player to choose from.

I'm trying to get "Theater Option A" to dissapear if the player doesn't choose it on the first move, but it is giving me a real struggle. Obviously I'm doing something wrong. Can anybody give me some help here?

Ray (alias "the newb scenario doodly" Lava)

ORIGINAL: Lava

Hi!

Working on my scenarion "The 4th Republic" and I'm trying to put a little twist in it but I'm having some problems. Perhaps one of youse veteran scenario designers can help me.

Here's the problem:

Using "Theater Option" I want to offer the player some choices at the beginning of the game. He will have "Theater Option A" or "Theater Option B." "Theater Option A" will be presented to him on Turn One. If he chooses this option things..[:)] will happen which may or may not be to his benefit. If he decides not to choose "Theater Option A" he then will be presented with "Theater Option B" on Turn 2 (and this option will remain for the rest of the game until he chooses it). The problem that I am having is that I can't figure out how to cancel "Theater Option A" if the player doesn't choose it.

Here's what I've done:

Event 1 is "Theater Option A." This works fine and delivers what the player asks for.

Event 2 - I've tried a "1 occupies" his own capital here with a delay of 1.

Event 3
Event Activated - Cancel Event - Activated 2
Delay 0 - Turn Range 1 - Cancel 1

Event 4 is "Theater Option B"

Unfortunately Event 3 does not cancel Event 1 and I'm left with both Theater Options for the player to choose from.

I'm trying to get "Theater Option A" to dissapear if the player doesn't choose it on the first move, but it is giving me a real struggle. Obviously I'm doing something wrong. Can anybody give me some help here?

Ray (alias "the newb scenario doodly" Lava)

I'm sure that other people have some elegant work-arounds, but this is also a known problem that's fixed in TOAW 3.

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick
I'm sure that other people have some elegant work-arounds, but this is also a known problem that's fixed in TOAW 3.

Ah!

Thanks Ralph! Great news!

Kewl, well I'll set up the scenario with the different options and hopefully, with TOAW 3 I'll be able to juggle them on an either/or basis.

Ray (alias Lava)

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick

I'm sure that other people have some elegant work-arounds, but this is also a known problem that's fixed in TOAW 3.

Good fix, but could this impact the event structure of TOAW-COW scenarios which are being ported to TOAW 3?

Regards, RhinoBones

They should port cleanly.

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick

ORIGINAL: Lava

Hi!

Working on my scenarion "The 4th Republic" and I'm trying to put a little twist in it but I'm having some problems. Perhaps one of youse veteran scenario designers can help me.

Here's the problem:

Using "Theater Option" I want to offer the player some choices at the beginning of the game. He will have "Theater Option A" or "Theater Option B." "Theater Option A" will be presented to him on Turn One. If he chooses this option things..[:)] will happen which may or may not be to his benefit. If he decides not to choose "Theater Option A" he then will be presented with "Theater Option B" on Turn 2 (and this option will remain for the rest of the game until he chooses it). The problem that I am having is that I can't figure out how to cancel "Theater Option A" if the player doesn't choose it.

Here's what I've done:

Event 1 is "Theater Option A." This works fine and delivers what the player asks for.

Event 2 - I've tried a "1 occupies" his own capital here with a delay of 1.

Event 3
Event Activated - Cancel Event - Activated 2
Delay 0 - Turn Range 1 - Cancel 1

Event 4 is "Theater Option B"

Unfortunately Event 3 does not cancel Event 1 and I'm left with both Theater Options for the player to choose from.

I'm trying to get "Theater Option A" to dissapear if the player doesn't choose it on the first move, but it is giving me a real struggle. Obviously I'm doing something wrong. Can anybody give me some help here?

Ray (alias "the newb scenario doodly" Lava)

I'm sure that other people have some elegant work-arounds, but this is also a known problem that's fixed in TOAW 3.

What?! This isn't a "known problem". Designers are perfectly capable of removing Theater Options in all earlier versions of TOAW. They just have to use the correct technique.

To remove a Theater Option, create an identical Theater Option (exact same message) and set it's target event to 500. In TOAW3 that target event will be 1000, instead.

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay

What?! This isn't a "known problem". Designers are perfectly capable of removing Theater Options in all earlier versions of TOAW. They just have to use the correct technique.

To remove a Theater Option, create an identical Theater Option (exact same message) and set it's target event to 500. In TOAW3 that target event will be 1000, instead.

Yeah. What's more, the "cancel event" effect has the separate existing purpose of preventing a TO turning up at all rather than removing it after its appeared.

Well...

The question was how to put a string of Theater Options together such that if one event is chosen, another would "disappear" and not be able to be slected.

Now obviously, I'm not a "capable" designer, but here is how I solved my problem:

What I wanted was the ability to add "advanced" forces to my army based not by scripted events, but the players desires. I wanted to give him choices, but deny him the ability to choose them all. In this case, I have 3 different options with six different categories of advanced forces. The player can only pick one from each option. To do this I created "Reseach Islands," and it looks like this:



It works like this. The player puts his "Civilian" reseachers on a ship and lands on the island with the category he wishes to receive advanced forces in. I made them islands because it means that my "civ" researches can only go to one destination a turn via ship. When he reaches that destination, a blocking enemy icon is created to stop him from picking the next turn from the same option.

Looks like this:



In the shot, I selected "Fleet" on my first move and the enemy generated a force on "Fighter" to prevent me from choosing it on turn two. The shot shows turn two in which I have moved from "Fleet" and landed on "Missile." The player is given the first 3 turns of the game to make his selections. On turn 4, I withdraw the "Civ" unit and the "blocking" enemy army... ending the research phase. I surrounded my research islands by non-playable black hexes to prevent the player trying to cheat.

Each option has a "1 occupies" event from which I use as a basis to bring forces into the game as they are "researched."

Granted, it's not very "elegent" but it serves my purposes.

Ray (alias Lava)

EDIT: Oops.. changed the "civ" unit from an army to a squad to prevent it from being divided and occupying both categories in the same option on the same turn.

ORIGINAL: Curtis Lemay
What?! This isn't a "known problem". Designers are perfectly capable of removing Theater Options in all earlier versions of TOAW. They just have to use the correct technique.

To remove a Theater Option, create an identical Theater Option (exact same message) and set it's target event to 500. In TOAW3 that target event will be 1000, instead.

You're right, of course. I was thinking of nukes.

ORIGINAL: Lava

Granted, it's not very "elegent" but it serves my purposes.

If this saves events that's all well and good- aesthetics are a secondary consideration. Other designers have used such on-map TOs in some circumstances.

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: Lava

Granted, it's not very "elegent" but it serves my purposes.

If this saves events that's all well and good- aesthetics are a secondary consideration. Other designers have used such on-map TOs in some circumstances.

Well..

It does seem to work as I intended. Never seen anybody else's set-up before so it was a hairpulling exercise that took the better part of two nights to figure out.

Now that I've got it worked out, it struck me that I could set it up such that if the player picks one option his opponent gets the other. So for example, if I choose advanced fleet operations, my opponent will get advanced fighters. Still thinking it out... just some spice and a little something different to throw into the scenario.

Ray (alias Lava)

ORIGINAL: Lava
It does seem to work as I intended. Never seen anybody else's set-up before so it was a hairpulling exercise that took the better part of two nights to figure out.

Yeah. Good for you for working it out by yourself. Builds character. FWIW I haven't seen precisely this variation before.

So for example, if I choose advanced fleet operations, my opponent will get advanced fighters.

Well, it could be done, but in this particular case it doesn't seem very logical.

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: Lava
So for example, if I choose advanced fleet operations, my opponent will get advanced fighters.

Well, it could be done, but in this particular case it doesn't seem very logical.

Yep... I'm still mulling that over... My rationale being, if I get a technological advantage, why shouldn't my opponent receive one as well?

Ray (alias Lava)

ORIGINAL: Lava

Yep... I'm still mulling that over... My rationale being, if I get a technological advantage, why shouldn't my opponent receive one as well?

Ray (alias Lava)

Right; the thing to do though would be to give them their own set of options (making sure to come up with a set of events to handle this for the PO as it won't be able to do it on its own); just giving them the opposite of whatever you picked doesn't make much sense.

ORIGINAL: golden delicious

ORIGINAL: Lava

Yep... I'm still mulling that over... My rationale being, if I get a technological advantage, why shouldn't my opponent receive one as well?

Ray (alias Lava)

Right; the thing to do though would be to give them their own set of options (making sure to come up with a set of events to handle this for the PO as it won't be able to do it on its own); just giving them the opposite of whatever you picked doesn't make much sense.

Ah!

I see what you mean. Good point.

Ray (alias Lava)

Ah, speaking of Theater Options. Don't know if this has already been mentioned but there is a known bug in that the TO display screen does not scroll. So if you fill it up with active TO's (15 or 16, I forget the exact number) any extras won't display.

ORIGINAL: Raindem

Ah, speaking of Theater Options. Don't know if this has already been mentioned but there is a known bug in that the TO display screen does not scroll. So if you fill it up with active TO's (15 or 16, I forget the exact number) any extras won't display.

That was fixed. The scrollbars were removed.[:'(] According to Norm, it would have been difficult to add more options.

ORIGINAL: ralphtrick

ORIGINAL: Raindem

Ah, speaking of Theater Options. Don't know if this has already been mentioned but there is a known bug in that the TO display screen does not scroll. So if you fill it up with active TO's (15 or 16, I forget the exact number) any extras won't display.

That was fixed. The scrollbars were removed.[:'(] According to Norm, it would have been difficult to add more options.

Difficult then, but, maybe in the future?

Anything's possible.