Matrix Games Forums

I am seeing a bit of disatisfaction over Matrix Games re releasing games to the wargaming public, or more specifically, it's disatisfaction over the expected price of the item it seems.

I am going to state, I am not one of the disatisfied.

TOAW3, what's it worth to a wargamer?
Well, if you have a previous version (I have TOAW CoW), you might think "gee do I really want TOAW3 enough to pay 40 bucks for it?"
The problem with this line of thinking, is, if you already own a copy of an earlier version, yes, it will not be so entirely thrilling to have to pay for it all over again.
But, did Matrix Games initiate the process just to give those that had TOAW CoW an update? I don't think so.
I think Matrix Games wanted to restore a great wargame, to the buying public.
And, if you have never bought TOAW (any version) before, is 40 bucks a fair price for it? Well duh, yeah.
Would it have been nice if TOAW3 was the TOAW that was sold back in 1998? Well, duh, yeah. But it wasn't.

Now, if the game had been obtained as TOAW CoW ie not modified a damned bit before being made available, would this have been ok? Well, maybe, if Matrix Games had made it clear, we are only selling this product, we aren't planning to modify it though.
But, as it goes, Matrix Games routinely does it's darndest to make anything they sell better.
How much was TOAW CoW likely worth as a game unmodified? Likely not 40 bucks. But that is what it was going to cost you from Take2 eh.
So as I see it, you could have had TOAW CoW for 40 bucks, or TOAW3 for 40 bucks. Honestly, it is not defendible saying Matrix Games is asking too much for TOAW3.

Now I am not all the knowledgable with Harpoon. I only know, Matrix Games has released it recently. I am confident they have improved the game. I am also confident, claiming it is unfair to sell it "full price" is no more fair, than claiming selling TOAW3 is unfair.

I expect, when Matrix Games is finished tweaking the Campaign series, it will be a much improved game option. And I won't be annoyed if they price it full price too.

I own the Campaign series. It runs in XP, but it isn't like it runs 100% no headaches. It would be nice if the install was completely devoid of me giving a single thought to the install and running of this series. It likely would be worth a redundant purchase.

I ask myself, aside from new titles from SSG or Panther Games, what other wargames are worth really giving a damn about really.
I'd rather see some proven classics refitted and made fully playable, then take risks on yet another flashy all promises no proven track record title.

I have the V4Victory games here. The cds are in great shape, they are merely worthless in XP. And I have tried to fiddle with DosBox, but it says something about the ease of use of something like DosBox, if I can say formatting and reloading my OS is easy in comparison.
I'd love to amuse myself with the V4Victory titles maybe once more through a revamped release.

Guys, if you already own the older classics, and you resent having to pay the same price as a customer that has never bought it before, please, just accept that that's just too bad eh.
Either buy it, or resort to something like Dosbox, or running a vintage paperweight grade computer with a vintage OS.
You're not required to replace those old games, it's likely just a good idea

IMHO the ongoing support level/community in itself is worth the price of admission , if indeed the title was one I have truly enjoyed .

ORIGINAL: Sarge

IMHO the ongoing support level/community in itself is worth the price of admission , if indeed the title was one I have truly enjoyed .

I second that thought. Just the fact that the game is now being sold and supported will keep the community growing and thriving. Games that are no longer sold or supported can only keep a fan community around so long...and playing online is what keeps many games interesting year after year.

There are people who'll whine no matter what the price is. If Matrix had sold TOAW3 for $0, the whine would have been, "What's wrong with it? There must something wrong with it, since it's free!"

ORIGINAL: Les_the_Sarge_9_1
I have the V4Victory games here. The cds are in great shape, they are merely worthless in XP. And I have tried to fiddle with DosBox, but it says something about the ease of use of something like DosBox, if I can say formatting and reloading my OS is easy in comparison.

Try using a frontend for dosbox. Makes it very easy to use. Without it I wouldn't use dosbox, but with this it is a breeze to configure and play old games.

Frontend for dosbox:
http://members.home.nl/mabus/

You'll be able to find links to various front ends (I use DFend) on the DOSBox homepage. Without one, it's basically useless.

I have to agree.

$40.00 for a game that will last a lifetime is nothing.

Heck, I spend $40.00 just to fill up my car with gas each week...

Matrix deserves our thanks for the fact that they are willing to bring back these classic games, update them, and further support them down the road....[&o]

Matrix will price the games at the level at which they think they will make the most money, balancing volume of sales against profit per sale. That is quite reasonable, as that is what all businesses (well, successful ones anyway) do. If they have got it wrong, they will no doubt chalk up a mark to experience, drop the price and/or not pursue such projects in future.

Nobody is unaware that these are re-releases of old (sometimes very old!) games, with various degrees of updating. So far, to me, the prices seem perfectly reasonable for new purchasers... good wargames have a long shelf-life. Existing owners can choose whether to buy or not, depending on whether they think the new material offers value for money or not. To take myself for example, such consideration meant "yes" for TAOW but will mean "no" for the Battleground games and probably "no" for the Campaign series.

ORIGINAL: Hertston

Matrix will price the games at the level at which they think they will make the most money, balancing volume of sales against profit per sale. That is quite reasonable, as that is what all businesses (well, successful ones anyway) do. If they have got it wrong, they will no doubt chalk up a mark to experience, drop the price and/or not pursue such projects in future.

Nobody is unaware that these are re-releases of old (sometimes very old!) games, with various degrees of updating. So far, to me, the prices seem perfectly reasonable for new purchasers... good wargames have a long shelf-life. Existing owners can choose whether to buy or not, depending on whether they think the new material offers value for money or not. To take myself for example, such consideration meant "yes" for TAOW but will mean "no" for the Battleground games and probably "no" for the Campaign series.

I agree, and I also think it's perfectly reasonable to support Matrix as a company by buying their products and getting others involved as well. After all, Matrix is keeping alive a hobby we love, not to mention they allow their customers to have a say in what they'd like to see. Try going to EA sports and asking them to bring an old classic back, I doubt their leadership will be so available to respond to your comments.

ORIGINAL: jeffthewookiee
Try going to EA sports and asking them to bring an old classic back, I doubt their leadership will be so available to respond to your comments.

Asking isn't necessary - they do it every year and charge full price! [:D]

Yoo pays yer money, yoo makes yer choice. [8D]

I have most of Matrix Games erm games in my collection and am universally dire at all of them [:D]

But I have no complaints with the price and to be honest here the weak dollar is helping me.. ahem support Matrix Games more than I could normally [8|]

Not bad for Tightfisted Scot

Cheers

Jev

With re-release games (whether by the original publisher or via a "restorer", I do wish there were a separate price for the "upgrade".  Even $10 off would be appreciated as recognition that I bought the title once already.  But it is especially bad to buy a bug ridden title like HOI and then have all the design issues fixed as HOI2 and be expected to pay full price yet again.
 
I would also be nice if Matrix supported frequent customers by giving a discount based on total purchases.  Imagine if the store gave a discount of $1 for every previous Matrix product purchased (up to a maximum of $10 or $15).  [:'(]

ORIGINAL: jchastain

With re-release games (whether by the original publisher or via a "restorer"), I do wish there were a separate price for the "upgrade". Even $10 off would be appreciated as recognition that I bought the title once already.

The trouble with that is its practicality, or lack of it. Unless you have an electronic record of existing purchasers (as is the case of some of those who have recently bought Harpoon 3), how do you identify such people? Going through the "send us your old disk" routine would take time and money - and probably remove any profit element from the reduced price. An upgrade to the new game (as opposed to the new game itself) would obviously be even more expensive for them.

I would also be nice if Matrix supported frequent customers by giving a discount based on total purchases.

That's an excellent idea, though! [:D]

Warfare 1,

Eye-catching Avatar!

One really can't complain about Matrix's prices.  There never has been any money in Wargames and probably never will be.  Given the history of wargames I will glad if they stay in business.  Remember SPI (the first one), Avalon Hill, GDW, and many many more.
 
Bob

Zap:

Warfare 1,

Eye-catching Avatar!

Heheh

This is me after a long night of wargaming....

Started young... [:D]

I got TOAW Elite from Canada for $4.99....where do you get this $40 bucks stuff?

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

I got TOAW Elite from Canada for $4.99....where do you get this $40 bucks stuff?

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

I got TOAW Elite from Canada for $4.99....where do you get this $40 bucks stuff?

Actually, I know where you can get TOAW Elite for free. But that's TOAW Elite, and that hasn't been on sale now for hmmm like 7-8 years (which is like forever in the computer gaming business). I assume you meant TOAW Elite volume 1?

Should also be mentioned, getting TOAW Elite Volume 1 running in XP is either impossible, or requires a great lot of skill.

Then there was Wargame of the Year edition, but that too is likely not worth much cash. Then there was Century of Warfare. But buying that today, is kinda dumb considering TOAW3 defacto makes it worthless as a new product.

So, in the end, I would gladly pay 40 bucks for TOAW3 (if I had 40 bucks I would buy it tonight). But I wouldn't give you 5 bucks let alone 4.99 Canadian for any of the earlier versions.

Really, it's quite simple...........
 
Vote with your money! No real reason to bitch on-line, eh?
 
If your of the camp that thinks that a 'rerelease' of a game isn't worth your bucks, don't buy it, eh?
 
Myself, everything about ToaW3 is worth MY time/money.....so basically, I'll just ignore the nay-sayers and drive on.
 
'Nuff said!