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Here's a good general question.

I have used groups of S-Boats as minelaying groups (5 S-Boats mine Truk for nice results) but have not used them as AK Killer Groups. Does anyone have experience operating S-Boats in tandem or in wolfpacks as AK/barge hunters?

When should the US start wolfpack operations? I know from historical SUBPAC operations they didn't start doing this until 1944.

Also, does anyone know how to keep the Argonaut and Nautilus from engaging in frequent surface actions. I know they each have 2 6" guns but they are very fragile. I lost the Argonaut in a surface battle against a DD recently and can't imagine why they would have done that in reality. BTW, the Argonaut initiated the battle.

I have done it with Jap subs. Not very succsessfull in ordinary combat. Seems the US find everyone and thus damage more of my subs. I had 6 in a pack but now only one and one.

Just sunk the Argonaut with a DD. It engaged in surfrace combat, no change against my DD. Had 4 of them in the area.

ORIGINAL: Mike Wethington

Here's a good general question.

I have used groups of S-Boats as minelaying groups (5 S-Boats mine Truk for nice results) but have not used them as AK Killer Groups. Does anyone have experience operating S-Boats in tandem or in wolfpacks as AK/barge hunters?

If you mean have I operated several 1-sub tfs in a hex? Yes. I've never noticed that stacking sub tfs in a hex is more effective than having them spread out over a possible target's course, however.

If you mean have I operated several subs in one tf? No. Doubt if it's still around on the forum but there were a few topics about why you shouldn't do that.

When should the US start wolfpack operations? I know from historical SUBPAC operations they didn't start doing this until 1944.

Depends on how you like to use subs. Some people use them for skirmish/scout lines, some like to refit/surge them en masse, others like to maintain constant presence. Remember, your opponent's asw is going to be much better than the IJN's irl and your Mk-14s suck unitl mid-43 (IIRC).

Also, does anyone know how to keep the Argonaut and Nautilus from engaging in frequent surface actions. I know they each have 2 6" guns but they are very fragile. I lost the Argonaut in a surface battle against a DD recently and can't imagine why they would have done that in reality. BTW, the Argonaut initiated the battle.

Don't think there's answer for that. Rationalizing you could imagine a situation where a radarless Argo runs into a radarless dd in at close range limited visibility and gets the drop on her. That or her skipper went temporarily insane. [;)]

Thanks for the good info.

I agree about the insanity rationalization. It does seem to be the only thing that makes sense in certain UV sitations - Oh, look IJN CVs 4 hexes away! Oh, look IJN AKs three hexes away - Get those DBs and TBDs up and flying against the AKs NOW! Before the freight us to death!

Air crews to their planes! All hands battle stations! [:)]

Operating multiple subs in the same hex increases detection levels
and decreases the chances for attacking shipping, not sure if there was a penalty
for wolfpacking either but there maight be.
When I played UV I found that if you place several subs in different hexes
and staggared them to sail thru certain hexes in crisscrossing patterns you
would have decent results as you sometimes attacked the same convoy in 2 different
hexes by the same sub.

Just lay ambushes in crisscrossing patterns
were some subs follow along the approaches and
others crossover the choke points but always moving them.

What he said. Much better operational advice. That toast is a sly one.

ORIGINAL: anarchyintheuk

ORIGINAL: Mike Wethington

Also, does anyone know how to keep the Argonaut and Nautilus from engaging in frequent surface actions. I know they each have 2 6" guns but they are very fragile. I lost the Argonaut in a surface battle against a DD recently and can't imagine why they would have done that in reality. BTW, the Argonaut initiated the battle.

Don't think there's answer for that. Rationalizing you could imagine a situation where a radarless Argo runs into a radarless dd in at close range limited visibility and gets the drop on her. That or her skipper went temporarily insane. [;)]

Save the Argonaut and Nautilus for sinking japanese barges...