Matrix Games Forums

It seems that forum has been cleared.
After a long debate, I think that I can resume the House rules that near all of us agree. At this we can name “Standard House Rules”. This way, to play PEBM with a new friend, we can say simply: “we ́ll play with standard house rules”, or “we ́ll play with standard house rules except... or adding...”

1) A unit only can do a single change of HQ every turn (no HQ mules).
2) A HQ cańt attack two times a single target. But a target can be attacked two (or more) times from various HQ́s.
3) To move a unit must be a division in it.
4) A Pz korp or Tank army must have a Pz, Motorized, Pzg, Tank, Mechanized or Cavalry division, to move 5 hexes. If not, only can move as infantry.
5) In the West and Sud fronts must be, in each and minimum, 2 fighters and 1 bomber. They can be at training mode. The West aircrafts can be, if necessary, at Wermatch HQ.
6) The soviet HQ ́s at 3 hexes (or less) from the east border, are in Siberia and cańt be air attacked. The air units in these HQ ́s can ́t fight, they must be in training mode.
7) The Finns cańt attack the north part or Leningrad, except with artillery or aircrafts. They will can attack Leningrad or go into Russia if falls Moscow, Stalingrad or Leningrad itself (any of these cities). Even then, the Finns units cańt go more far than 6 hexes from Leningrad. If Helsinki falls, the Finns units surrender.
8) Hungarians, Rumanians or Finns can ́t go to the West or Sud fronts. Italians cańt go to West front.
9) If a isolated unit receives air supply, only can ́t to advance or to attack to their home lines. If it don ́t receives air supply, can do anything.
10) Hungarians and Rumanians can ́t be at the same korp.

Amen.
Any suggestion?

if you take the area east of finland murmansk gets isolated [or is it already this way]and soviets cant benefit from it.

germans get a small[random]number of squads killed due to resistance of civilians each turn.

Originally posted by french fries:

if you take the area east of finland murmansk gets isolated [or is it already this way]and soviets cant benefit from it.

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There is no way we could simulate Murmansk being isolated. Besides, the only realistic place to attack in order to isolate Murmansk is way to the north of the WiR map.

germans get a small[random]number of squads killed due to resistance of civilians each turn.

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Anyone have info on this? My knee jerk reaction is to say the partisans in the game represent (and should represent) the civilians fighting against the occupation. Of course the partisans system doesn't work as it should but we shouldn't add something that will probably get removed once the partisans system starts to really simulate the guerilla war in German occupied USSR. This would be a bit of work for Arnaud for no clear gain.

In the original Apple version, the level of replacements in the german pool did abstract anti partisan duty. The larger the pool, the less partisan activity on the map.
As for restricting the Finns, I agree, except the russians didn't know this in the real war. So if the russians know there is no threat from them they don't need to seriously defend against them.
BvB

and if the axis beat some parizans in the current version THEY DONT HAVE ANY LOSSES

Originally posted by Lorenzo from Spain:
It seems that forum has been cleared.
After a long debate, I think that I can resume the House rules that near all of us agree. At this we can name “Standard House Rules”. This way, to play PEBM with a new friend, we can say simply: “we ́ll play with standard house rules”, or “we ́ll play with standard house rules except... or adding...”

1) A unit only can do a single change of HQ every turn (no HQ mules).
2) A HQ cańt attack two times a single target. But a target can be attacked two (or more) times from various HQ́s.
3) To move a unit must be a division in it.
4) A Pz korp or Tank army must have a Pz, Motorized, Pzg, Tank, Mechanized or Cavalry division, to move 5 hexes. If not, only can move as infantry.
5) In the West and Sud fronts must be, in each and minimum, 2 fighters and 1 bomber. They can be at training mode. The West aircrafts can be, if necessary, at Wermatch HQ.
6) The soviet HQ ́s at 3 hexes (or less) from the east border, are in Siberia and cańt be air attacked. The air units in these HQ ́s can ́t fight, they must be in training mode.
7) The Finns cańt attack the north part or Leningrad, except with artillery or aircrafts. They will can attack Leningrad or go into Russia if falls Moscow, Stalingrad or Leningrad itself (any of these cities). Even then, the Finns units cańt go more far than 6 hexes from Leningrad. If Helsinki falls, the Finns units surrender.
8) Hungarians, Rumanians or Finns can ́t go to the West or Sud fronts. Italians cańt go to West front.
9) If a isolated unit receives air supply, only can ́t to advance or to attack to their home lines. If it don ́t receives air supply, can do anything.
10) Hungarians and Rumanians can ́t be at the same korp.

Amen.
Any suggestion?

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My suggestion :
AMEN

The house-rules themselves answer a few of my questions.

Can I assume then, if a unit has not moved, there is no penalty involved in changing HQ's. Even multiple times in a single turn. But changing HQ multiple times within a turn is against Lorenzo's PBEM rules.

The house-rules themselves answer a few of my questions.

Can I assume then, if a unit has not moved, there is no penalty involved in changing HQ's. Even multiple times in a single turn. But changing HQ multiple times within a turn is against Lorenzo's PBEM rules.

Originally posted by Greg J:
The house-rules themselves answer a few of my questions.

Can I assume then, if a unit has not moved, there is no penalty involved in changing HQ's. Even multiple times in a single turn. But changing HQ multiple times within a turn is against Lorenzo's PBEM rules.

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Greg,
you can change unit's HQ as many times as you want in single turn - no penalty, unless you play with Lorenzo's rules.

Originally posted by Greg J:
Can I assume then, if a unit has not moved, there is no penalty involved in changing HQ's. Even multiple times in a single turn. But changing HQ multiple times within a turn is against Lorenzo's PBEM rules.

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Hi Greg,

A clarification. The purpose of Lorenzo's rule #1 is to not allow a player to assign a corps from its normal HQ, to another HQ, whose only purpose is to pay the OPs for special supply, then reassign that unit back to its normal HQ after getting special supply. The normal HQ is the one with a good leader, plenty of OPs, air units, and reinforcing ground units. The original HQ is not used for anything else but to save the normal HQ the cost of providing special supply to its ground units. This is referred to as "HQ mules" as Lorenzo says (think pack mules hauling supply). This is considered by many/most to be an "exploit", something that the game unintentionally allows but should be prohibited. That's the reason for that rule, how many HQ changes the corps makes in one turn, beyond 2, is not the reason for the rule. 2 HQ changes used to allow the use of an HQ mule is what the rule is prohibiting. Changing the HQ, then deciding you made a mistake later and change it back, that is not a problem.

[ December 18, 2001: Message edited by: Ed Cogburn ]</p>

Hi All

I think i missed something, could someone explain the thinking behind rule 3.

3) To move a unit must be a division in it.

My front line units always have divisions(usually no less than three). Is rule 3 to stop people using 'throwaway' B'ns in corps shells to cut supply?

Nick

I believe so.

Originally posted by Lokioftheaesir:
Hi All

I think i missed something, could someone explain the thinking behind rule 3.

3) To move a unit must be a division in it.

My front line units always have divisions(usually no less than three). Is rule 3 to stop people using 'throwaway' B'ns in corps shells to cut supply?

Nick

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Exactly

Originally posted by Lorenzo from Spain:

4) A Pz korp or Tank army must have a Pz, Motorized, Pzg, Tank, Mechanized or Cavalry division, to move 5 hexes. If not, only can move as infantry.
Any suggestion?

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but certain scenarios starts with german pzkorps without motorized units in them. Do I have to move things around in those korps before using them, thus loosing one turn?

Originally posted by MagnusOlsson:


Correct me if I'm wrong, but certain scenarios starts with german pzkorps without motorized units in them. Do I have to move things around in those korps before using them, thus loosing one turn?

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Well, you don't have to lose a turn, just don't move that corps more than 2 squares. If you want to use it as a motorized corps then you'll need to take a turn eventually to put something motorized in it.

Originally posted by Ed Cogburn:



Well, you don't have to lose a turn, just don't move that corps more than 2 squares. If you want to use it as a motorized corps then you'll need to take a turn eventually to put something motorized in it.

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Magnus,
remember it has to have Panzer or Tank or Motorized or Mechanized or Cavalry division. Means just one of above is enough.