Russian status after updates to supply / air

[stjeand]

Not sure they can not garrison the west unless they defeat the UK forces.
Right now the UK has a massive ground army that would be ripe to invade France in 41 if the Germans could not garrison.
NOW if the UK lose a bunch of those units then yes they could be in trouble.

But that depends what your plan is...

Full on defense to slow the Germans...or all out attack in an attempt to beat them.

We will see. German infantry has reached yours..and as you can see they are equal. They should be 50% stronger so down 30% in strength and August is arriving. 4 or 5 turns left. Will need some luck. This turn was bad...lost 5 out of 6 air battles...

[AlvaroSousa]

Hadros is quite a good player. He beats me quite handily. He has played more games than I have though by a good measure.

[BrianG]

Overruns are a big issue. After 3/ 4 battles, my Russians are then overrun and lose 22 steps. Multiple times.

I think failing to retreat enough hexes is an issue. Or unit should then be put back into the return que.

Maybe week step units should get overrun. But not ones with hefty values. EVen at bad odds.

And on an aside, Generals really get kia'd in this game!!!

[MagicMissile]

I think the best answer to all in UK in France might be to try and kill as much UK units as possible, dont skip the Uboat building and skip 41 barbarossa and concentrate on harassing the UK.

Not sure how that will play out but I think it might work. I guess a bit like the Nirosi Boldairade AAR going on right now. I have never played against 11 UK corps but 8 is manageable.

Also why was the 3 hex retreat path introduced? That is what makes it possible for the UK to stuff France with units. Without it France would be too crowded and there would be shatters left and right I think.

When it comes to Russia I guess we come into the balancing question. In my 4 games with HarryB my Germans failed to finish the Soviets whereas HarryBs Germans stomped my Soviets easily. This with almost identical builds and setup both Germany and Soviet. Since I had never failed to defeat the Soviets before the new rules with improved garrisons there seems to be something I am missing [:)] but skills means a lot.
These games are very hard to balance just look at WitE 1 launched over 10 years ago and I doubt it is balanced even now, also WP a couple of years of patches now and balance still seems off a bit. Also who do you balance for the best players or the average players. Always been a big question if you look at RTS games like Starcraft and Warcraft for example.

Anyway coming back to Russia the feeling is that the Germans are a bit too strong and the Soviets are too weak so I am absolutely for trying to improve the Soviets in some way. And I think not necessarily improve the 1941 Soviets but 1942 onwards they seem to need a buff.

Warplan is still a great game though, I think I would like to play a bit after the next patch.

/MM

[aoffen]

I personally think NCC1701e is on the right track. The Soviets can hold in 41, but tend to fold in 42. I think they need their wartime pp and manpower buffed a bit. That’s probably enough on top of what’s been done.

In our game set ncc1701e has thrown a lot of resources against the UK but suffered against the Russians in 41 with a less successful Barbarossa (1942 my change that). I did the opposite and have done relatively better in Russia but am not succeeding in pressing the Brits at all. It’s a complex equation and difficult to balance.

The Russians do run out of men though, which seems wrong and is backed up buy his data and research. A pp and manpower buff likely solves it.

[stjeand]

Perhaps the Soviets get units based upon German advance distance? When the Germans take Kiev the Soviets get an army and so on...

AND perhaps these only come into play until a certain date.
SO if the Russians do not lose Kiev in 41 than they do not get the unit.

NOW this could create the Germans skipping places...BUT if they are key rail lines they can not.

Same could happen in 1942 but more so...IF the Russians lose Moscow they mobilize 3 armies...
Something like that.



MM I agree 100% with the experience piece but if HB is the ONLY Russian player than can hold Russia then something is not working.
HB is a fantastic player. I have only gotten to play him a few times so I have not been able to try any new German tactics...all have been prior patch. Not sure it will make a difference but I learned a lot going the distance.


My concern with the game has always been...

Russia is underpowered and the Allies over powered. The Allies should not be invading in 42 all over the place to slow down the Germans...they should be able to pull off and invasion to say Africa but not France or Italy yet...
And Russia should be pushed back but it should be tougher and tougher for the Germans...while it is normally easier.

[MagicMissile]

I in return agree with the western allies a bit too strong and USSR too weak. I think it has been mentioned before but that seems true about almost all Grand Strategy WW2 games. Maybe a result of the cold war I guess.

Also agree HB is very good. BTW anyone playing him now or has he retired as the basically unbeaten champion? I have not seen him add some wisdom to the forum for some time.

/MM

[stjeand]

Weather piece...


1) Cold should be worse that it is...winterized not affected...cold should slow movement and attack as well as effect efficiency, especially in Russia. Reading about this it was stated cold was worse that snow. Mud then cold froze tanks, trucks and guns to the ground that they could not free them until Spring.
2) Perhaps May should be rainy in Russia...could alot of the issues be fixed with less attack turns and a change to Cold?
3) Could Cold and Blizzard cause damage to units? Not sure if this is possible but similar damage to say an amphibious landing so rare but taking 5 to 15 hits all along the front could cause issues over the winter for the Axis, especially in 1941 when they were not prepared. Maybe it stops in 42?

[ncc1701e]

ORIGINAL: stjeand

AND perhaps these only come into play until a certain date.
SO if the Russians do not lose Kiev in 41 than they do not get the unit.

NOW this could create the Germans skipping places...BUT if they are key rail lines they can not.

Yeah like surrounding but not taking London. [;)]

[ncc1701e]

ORIGINAL: MagicMissile

I in return agree with the western allies a bit too strong and USSR too weak. I think it has been mentioned before but that seems true about almost all Grand Strategy WW2 games. Maybe a result of the cold war I guess.

Yeah thanks to people like David M. Glantz, we don't have only the stories of German generals saying that the Wehrmacht has lost only due to Adolf.

ORIGINAL: MagicMissile

Also agree HB is very good. BTW anyone playing him now or has he retired as the basically unbeaten champion? I have not seen him add some wisdom to the forum for some time.

He is all right. He is playing a new game he has received for Christmas named Gloomhaven. [:)]

[stjeand]

ORIGINAL: ncc1701e
He is all right. He is playing a new game he has received for Christmas named Gloomhaven.

A board game that does not use a computer...

OH the inhumanity.

[ncc1701e]

Well, I am playing a lot Ticket to Ride - First Journey with my daughters.
https://www.daysofwonder.com/tickettori ... t-journey/

This is more peaceful than Warplan.

[MagicMissile]

Ok thanks for the info good to know. I was a bit worried something might have happened.

When it comes to the weather I always wanted rain and possibly blizzard to be the resting time but fighting in cold and snow should be more possible than it is now. That would of course mean we need probably increase manpower and production maybe but the game would be more fun. i have never been keen on the fact that the action is basically only 5 out of 12 months every year whereas in the real war winter in the east was full of action that is hard to replicate in the game as of now.

/MM

[AlvaroSousa]

The manpower very slight increase was due to Germany literally running out of manpower in 1944.

Ok so here are some questions for those having trouble.
#1 do you max out lend lease to Russia from the Allies? (very important)
#2 do you have some strategic bombing game in play as the Allies? (this eats up resources and possibly air sups)

These two are very key.

[AlvaroSousa]

I think the easiest safest solution is to increase their unit and base experience by 5%.

[sveint]

Yes to both questions.

In a typical game I'm playing right now as the Allies the Axis have not done too well. France was a bit of a struggle and already in the summer of 41 the UK has taken Tripoli. The US has two heavy bombers ready to deploy when they join the war, so that they can immediately contribute too.

But in the east the situation is different. While the Axis has "only" reached roughly historical advances, the Soviet army only numbers just under 2000 strength. I barely have enough units to hold the entire line. I have literally no strategic reserves. Land experience is 39% and air experience is 35% (even though the Soviet air force fought well and is now reduced to nothing - all reinforcements are off on air units). I already know what will happen in 1942. With no reserves and no mobile units the Axis will run rings around the units I do have. And the Soviets will collapse.

Again, this is a typical game. (I have tried many different tactics with the Soviets, nothing matters, players simply don't have the options or tools necessary).

[sveint]

ORIGINAL: AlvaroSousa

The manpower very slight increase was due to Germany literally running out of manpower in 1944.

I manage my manpower very carefully and have never had this problem. Indeed since the latest patch I often find my Germans sitting at 99% manpower. And I really like infantry, I buy lots of it.

[sveint]

And many others have mentioned, the problem is 1942.

1941 should be, and is, a catastrophe for the Soviets.
1942 should not be, but is, a catastrophe for the Soviets.

The only reason the Germans advanced as they did in 1942 was because they achieved strategic surprise. They had virtually no chance of taking Moscow in 1942, even though if you look at a map they were not far from it. In WarPlan in 1942 we have the Soviets facing 20-strength elite German units with basic infantry and immobile armor.

[ncc1701e]

ORIGINAL: AlvaroSousa

Ok so here are some questions for those having trouble.
#1 do you max out lend lease to Russia from the Allies? (very important)
#2 do you have some strategic bombing game in play as the Allies? (this eats up resources and possibly air sups)

These two are very key.

#1. I am doing well in BoA so I have the max for LL as UK only so far. And I am planning to do the same with USA.

#2. No, I have two strategic bombers with Detection and Electronics doing raids on subs bases but not every turn. USA has one strategic bomber but they are not yet at war.

[stjeand]

I maxed lend least to the Russians...but ran out of manpower. They basically had 42% at the start of the Spring of 42...I could not longer build units. Only received 22 MP per turn...and the Russian units cost 36...

I never build strat bombers...
They cost to much and normally I lose 4 per attack to flak alone...and do not have the resources to keep them repaired...add to that they 20% efficiency per attack if not more and in my testing it takes 2 months to gain that back. So you can use them 3 times then not again for 2 months. Does not really do much.
Perhaps something changed...but I have never seen it effect Germany unless you have 4 to 8 bombers...and if you have that...then you can't fight on the ground.