Here we go again! tc464 (A) vs. Mike (J) - No tc464

[Mike Solli]

Hi David.  If there turns out to be anything that needs a restart, then that won't work for my game.  The only thing I've heard of in patch 2 that may require a restart is monsoons.  I can live without it.  If I were you, I'd wait until patch 2 arrives before starting.  I couldn't bear the thought of doing this all over.  My guess is >95% of patch 2 will work with my game. 
 
If you want to start discussing your turn 1, start your AAR now.  I just love bantering about this game.  It might give me some more ideas for this game.  It's not too late to change things yet.  I still plan on minor tweaks happening here until game time. [:D]

[fabertong]

Thanks Mike........I will wait for P-2....but am desperate to get started........I may start my AAR early......might help kill the time until the patch.......and get a bit of banter on the go.......

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: fabertong

Hi Mike......as always this is very illuminating.........I know I've asked this (sort of) before......but I'm also waiting for the patch....and haven't even started a turn one because I thought you needed to start the turn under patch 2....and not just patch before ending turn 1.......do you know which is right....I'd love to post some thoughts on my Turn one here.....but you-know-who might see......

That's my impression too.

[Mike Solli]

I guess we'll find out.  Hopefully soon.

[Mike Solli]

Faber's AAR reminded me of another thing I wanted to mention.  That single AO that begins the game with KB and the Replenishment TF has an agenda of it's own.  It's too slow to merge with the Replenishment TF, so it's going to dump it's load of fuel at Kushiro.  Kushiro begins with only 500 fuel and I plan on having a LOT of xAKs moving in and out of that port.

[Mike Solli]

Musashi vs. Taiho

Very good question.  I haven't made a decision yet but here are my thoughts:

Not yet sure about the Musashi.  I'm going to start my game when the final version of patch 2 comes out.  I'm not sure how many naval shipbuilding points the Japanese player is short but I know there is a shortage on 7 Dec.  On 8 Dec, I'm going to halt the Yamato, Musashi and Shinano for 1 turn to determine the shortage.  I am doing that to determine the naval shipbuilding point shortage.  On 9 Dec, I will turn on Yamato, keep Shinano off and make a decision about Musashi.   I'm reluctant to keep the Musashi off because Japanese BBs are very powerful early in the game and that capability decreases with time.  I like to use the BBs to ambush Allied cruiser TFs.  I do not want my BBs to tangle with Allied BBs.  They end up in the repair yard (or worse).  Eventually (early 44 on), they usually end up dead or in the repair shop whenever they appear.  So, my decision is either to build her early or not at all.

I agree with Q-Ball that the Taiho is a very powerful ship and is a better choice than the Musashi.  Given that, I'd really like to accelerate her.  More on that in a second.  First, a short discussion on my ideas for accelerating ships:

Here's a quote from the manual on ship production/acceleration:

"13.4.1 JAPANESE SHIP PRODUCTION
All ships remove 1 day of delay when the delay is greater than:
»» 10 * Ship Durability
This automatic delay removal does not cost Naval or Merchant shipyard points. Those ships set
for normal construction with a delay less than 10 * Ship Durability require Naval or Merchant
shipyard points equal to their durability to remove 1 delay (each day). If set to accelerated
production, the ship will remove 2 days of delay (each day) for a cost equal to 3 times its
durability. A ship that has a delay over 10 * Ship Durability and less than 30 * Ship Durability
may be accelerated. It will remove 1 additional delay (other than the free 1 delay removal) each
day for a cost of appropriate shipyard points equal to the ship’s durability."
 
Note the bold portion.  The way I read that means (to me) that if you accelerate a ship at (10 to 30) * Ship Durability, you remove 2 days of delay for the cost of 1 * Ship Durability.  All accleration will only be during that period of time.  I do not plan on ever acclerating a ship at <10 * Ship Durability (in days of delay remaining).

No on to the Taiho question.  Yes, I'd love to have her early.  Is she worth that cost?  Not sure.  Getting her in 1943 can cause the Allied player lots of problems. [:D] The problem is that I like to accelerate the other CVs, the Hiyo, and some DDs too.  That's too much.  What to do...

I like to allocate points to certain ships.  I'll figure out how many naval ship points are available and then allocate 68 (or whatever it is in AE) to 1 CV, 115 (or whatever it is in AE) to the Taiho and a set number to DDs.  I like to keep ~6 DDs accelerated if possible.  I like to keep about 500 naval shipbuilding points in the pool.  If it begins to drop, there are three alternatives. 

1. Remove something from acceleration.  This is my last resort.  If I do, it's usually a DD. 
2. Halt something.  I usually do this.  I tend to halt Ro class subs.  To me, they are the least useful for a couple of reasons.  If hit, more often than not they die.  Second, they carry so few torps that they spend much of their time moving to and from their patrol stations.
3. Increase shipbuilding points.  If I do this, it's usually in Dec 42 (modestly and not very often) or in late Spring, 42.  I'm very cautious with economic increases and this is not high on the priority list.

I have not increased my naval (or merchant) ship points.  I won't even consider it until 9 Dec 41 at the earliest, after I have a chance to determine my baseline.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

  I do not plan on ever acclerating a ship at <10 * Ship Durability (in days of delay remaining).

Taiho though is definitely at <10* Ship Durability in days of delay. So if you consider her, you will have to break that rule.

She will consume 309 pts. per day of Naval Ship points, or about 1/4 of your entire budget. That isn't cheap. Accelerating her can't be taken lightly. You still have to find a little after halting Musashi, which frees up 233 points a day.

Halting the RO-boats is a very good idea. I like the seaplane subs though, so I don't want to push those out too much. But a RO-boat costs almost as much as Agano; which would you rather have?

I don't advocate accelerating the Junyos. Each one will cost an extra 168 pts a day, which I would rather apply toward the 206 extra you need for Taiho. They just ain't worth it, not when I consider Taiho to be almost as good as the two Junyos put together.

I would spend the 183 pts. a turn to accelerate the first 3 Unryus. Once they get to 610 days delay, you have to decide whether to up the ante and spend more, but you can at least knock 6 months off of each one pretty cheaply.

Overall, I am in the Taiho camp, but I can also see missing Musashi.

[Mike Solli]

So many fun toys, so few points. [:D]

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

So many fun toys, so few points. [:D]

Yes! Too bad the game doesn't start in 1936, and we can start monkeying with the production then!

We can cancel the Yamatos, the Katoris, the CSs, in fact the whole shadow program can bite me.

We go to war with 3 extra Shokakus, all Nagaras converted to AA cruisers, and the Frank so heavily researched we get it in in July of 1942. BANZAI!

[Monter_Trismegistos]

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
We can cancel [...] the CSs,

Yeah, but this would save Merchant points for you - few additional AKs, not CVs

[erstad]

Yeah, but this would save Merchant points for you - few additional AKs, not CVs

Not AKs, TKs!

[SqzMyLemon]

I haven't even looked at naval build points yet, I'm so overwhelmed as it is. Great thread Mike, learning tons. I think I'm going to bite the bullet and install witpstaff though...I'm really worried about getting my economy going.

Sounds like you have organized your fleet smartly, don't forget to add in contingency planning! In my other PBEM, both POW and Repulse are active, they were never spotted, and they have caused me to revise my Malaya/Borneo strategy. And on an even better note, he wiped out my intial Wake invasion force, that caused more grief! I wasn't prepared for such an aggresive move so early. So my advice after playing a week in game time...best laid plans...

You're an invaluable resource with the time and effort you are putting into the game as the Japanese, keep up the great thread. [&o]

[Mike Solli]

Yeah, I don't expect to see Force Z.&nbsp; I expect Ted to run with it so he can harass me later.&nbsp; He did that in our WitP game.&nbsp; I'll just make sure and have good naval search and Nells and Bettys ready to pounce.

[jwilkerson]

My take on the Taiho versus Musashi is that even with maximum acceleration, the Taiho will come in after the Japanese offensive phase is clearly over, where as with maximum acceleration, if this were possible, the Musashi might still see some use during the offensive phase. So, given that, I would postpone the Taiho and bring in the Musashi.

[undercovergeek]

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Load that 3-plane Val Chutai that starts in Pescadores onto Ryujo for a turn, and RESIZE; it now becomes a 19-plane Chutai.

ive shipped this to tokyo and have put it on one of the mini kbs ships - may or may not be ryujo, set it to resize - it acknowledges that the chutai now has the potential to be 19 in size, even asks if i want 16 more pilots, but it wont grow - any thoughts - plenty of vals in the pool

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Load that 3-plane Val Chutai that starts in Pescadores onto Ryujo for a turn, and RESIZE; it now becomes a 19-plane Chutai.

ive shipped this to tokyo and have put it on one of the mini kbs ships - may or may not be ryujo, set it to resize - it acknowledges that the chutai now has the potential to be 19 in size, even asks if i want 16 more pilots, but it wont grow - any thoughts - plenty of vals in the pool

Not sure; if the Max Size is now 19, you should be good to go. Take it off the ship and request replacement aircraft. If you can't get any, it could be because the base is low on supplies, or you haven't met the # of days delay yet (this is new to AE).

It works though, and using the same method you should have all the Jake units you need. You can even take 1-plane Jake units off ships that don't need them, like the Katoris, and expand them to 9-plane Chutais by loading them on an AV.

The main purpose of expanding the Val and Kate units is to provide advanced training for KB. You will need it!

[undercovergeek]

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

ORIGINAL: undercovergeek

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Load that 3-plane Val Chutai that starts in Pescadores onto Ryujo for a turn, and RESIZE; it now becomes a 19-plane Chutai.

ive shipped this to tokyo and have put it on one of the mini kbs ships - may or may not be ryujo, set it to resize - it acknowledges that the chutai now has the potential to be 19 in size, even asks if i want 16 more pilots, but it wont grow - any thoughts - plenty of vals in the pool

Not sure; if the Max Size is now 19, you should be good to go. Take it off the ship and request replacement aircraft. If you can't get any, it could be because the base is low on supplies, or you haven't met the # of days delay yet (this is new to AE).

It works though, and using the same method you should have all the Jake units you need. You can even take 1-plane Jake units off ships that don't need them, like the Katoris, and expand them to 9-plane Chutais by loading them on an AV.

The main purpose of expanding the Val and Kate units is to provide advanced training for KB. You will need it!

i will confess to having it on resize to fit ship before it landed on there - take it off and set it to no resize, next turn land on and set to resize again? ill try a few things - i read this when you first mentioned it - the vals have been shipping to tokyo ever since

[Mike Solli]

Question #1 for the masses:&nbsp; Try to&nbsp;hold Ichang or give it up?&nbsp; In our WitP PBEM, Ted pushed me out of Ichang early on.&nbsp; I'm still debating what to do.&nbsp; I think he is going to try and take it again.&nbsp; Assuming this, do I reinforce or withdraw (or do nothing).&nbsp; Also, should I suck supply there?&nbsp; I think there is something in the vicinity of 3k supply there.
&nbsp;
Question #2:&nbsp; What do you guys think of an air assault of the Philippines (in addition to the normal sea invasion)?&nbsp; I've done it in the past.&nbsp; Not sure if I'd gain anything by doing that.&nbsp; If I do it on Turn 1, I can be sure there will be little or no enemy fighter opposition.

[Q-Ball]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Question #1 for the masses:  Try to hold Ichang or give it up?  In our WitP PBEM, Ted pushed me out of Ichang early on.  I'm still debating what to do.  I think he is going to try and take it again.  Assuming this, do I reinforce or withdraw (or do nothing).  Also, should I suck supply there?  I think there is something in the vicinity of 3k supply there.

Question #2:  What do you guys think of an air assault of the Philippines (in addition to the normal sea invasion)?  I've done it in the past.  Not sure if I'd gain anything by doing that.  If I do it on Turn 1, I can be sure there will be little or no enemy fighter opposition.

Ichang isn't very useful in the end. Giving it up wouldn't bother me.

Para Drop on the PI? I think it would be most useful to drop on Altimonaon or one of those bases so you can ride the rails up from Legaspi, if you land there. But I wouldn't land there; I would prefer to land right on Altimonaon anyway and forget a landing at Legaspi.

[Mike Solli]

Good point about Ichang, Q-Ball.&nbsp; I've already changed the invasion site to Altimonaon.