Four Seasons with Models

[LJBurstyn]

ORIGINAL: Ormand

In the editor go to "Seting" and the bottom Proprty Sheet "Import & Other Settings", and set Loadable=TRUE as shown. This will allow you to use the button right below "Load a saved game" to load a game that you have saved. You will have to open the editor for another purpose, like a clicking the EDIT button on the front.

Does not work. Tried to load editor without a scenario and the scenario that created the game, set the Setting as suggested. Button starts to load scenario than comes up with message saying that game is not loadable exiting editor.

EDIT: If I knew how to attach a file I would attach my saved game but I don't so I won't.

[Ormand]

Odd. If you edit the scenario as shown, i.e., Loadable=True, when play and save a game, you should be able to load the save game within the editor. I have been doing this myself recently. I am not sure what the issue is. It isn't clear that if you attached it, it would help since I probably couldn't load it either.

[Ormand]

BTW, you have to make sure this is set in the random game file, and not the masterfile.

[LJBurstyn]

ORIGINAL: Ormand

BTW, you have to make sure this is set in the random game file, and not the masterfile.

Are you referring to the game created by the game machine or another file somewhere else?

I used the create game scenario gold and it created a game where the loadable was false..is this what you are talking about...once set it appears you cannot change it once you start the game.

[Ormand]

Yes, generate a random game as usual. When it comes up, click on "edit". The game will be in the editor, and since the masterfile is attached to it, you can't edit anything like SFT's, etc. But, got to the "Setng" tab and change Loadable to true. You needn't save it unless you want it for future use. Exit the editor, and start the game, and save turns. Later enter the editor by either editing a scenario or masterfile, or just clicking on the "Editor" tab on the main screen. Then, go to "Setngs" and use the "Load a saved game" tab to get a menu to open your saved turns. The key is that the Loadable=True has to be set before you play and save turns.

[LJBurstyn]

Started a new game doing the setting before actually playing and saving...have not yet reached the point where the enemy usually starts to suffer readiness penalties...but will report on the situation.

Got to do something about upgrading infantry units that uses models...having to build completely new units losing the experience of older units is tough.

During WWII.. even advanced units were upgraded with new equipment. My Dad's unit flew older C-46's until they were upgraded to C-47's almost immediately after they were deployed to China/India/Burma (CBI). Many squadrons were upgraded to new planes and tanks rather than having to build completely new units...so I think that it should be possible to upgrade almost all new equipment to old equipment units. One of my uncles (I had 15) was assigned to a tank division early in the war...he does not even remember the first tank...but he said it was OLD when he got into the Combat Team...they later upgraded to the Steward tank and later to the Sherman 76. And just before the war ended to a new Sherman with a larger gun (he did not remember how big because Germany surrendered and he was on his way home possibly to be transferred to Japan but the Nukes changed that--they left the new tanks in Europe so they could get home sooner). One of my uncles started in the infantry at Pearl Harbor (he was there on Dec 7 he was at church when the Japs attacked)...his unit fought in a lot of the battles in the pacific...they started with old (bolt action) rifles before they upgraded to the Garand. Another of my uncles (like I said I had 15) was in "Merrials" Marauders they started with bolt action rifles before they were upgraded to SMG's...they were preferred to the garand in jungle combat. Almost all my uncles were in the military during WWII some drafted but most volunteers after Pearl Harbor.

[Ormand]

Some hope with upgrades coming in 227. I will work on this over the weekend. It will not enable "all" that you want with models in that I don't that it will not be possible to upgrade to any model, but to one that is specified. My plan is to make it possible to upgrade linearly from a model that was used as the base for the upgrade or improvement. This will clearly solve the rifle upgrade issue, where you will be able to upgrade Mountain Infantry I to Mountain Infantry II. But, you won't be able to upgrade Mountain Infantry I to SMG II. The same is generally true of other models, such as tanks. If you make two types of light tanks, you won't be able to upgrade from Firefly I to Churchill II. While this is technically feasible, it is more complex, and would take some careful thought as how to implement it.

[Ormand]

Just uploaded new files v1.1.9. This requires ATG v227 or higher.

Changes:
1. Introduced upgrades for models (this requires v227 or higher). If a new model is created via a tech upgrade or an improvement, the previous model can be upgraded to the new model.
2. Tweaks to heavy weapons
2. Tweaks to AI role score for armor and infantry support units
3. Fixed some introduced logic errors for AI factory builds and raw and oil upgrades (I now remember that I left in a message that they are being upgraded; I'll have to remember to take that next time).
4. Did some randomization for initial starts: upgrade some raw and oil, place extra infantry and armor in cities based on a random number.

I hope I caught everything. Come Friday, 7/28, I will be more or less offline for the next three weeks.

[LJBurstyn]

Got new version of 4Seasons and ATG.

Don't know if this is happening to other units but I modeled a light tank...now it will autoupgrade every time I hit the autoupgrade button until I run out of supplies. No upgrade is actually taking place.

[Ormand]

Sorry, I don't quite understand what is happening in your case.

I did the following. Start a random game with a German regime. Created a light tank model Faust. Produced 10 of them, and put them in a unit. I then researched Tank Combat I, and improved the Faust to Faust B (the previous model became Faust A). I clicked on the FAUST A SFT in the unit and the "Text and Upgrade" window pops up. I incremented the counter by one, and hit upgrade (note if you don't increment the counter, no upgrade happens). One Faust A SFT converted to a Faust B. I then research Light Tank II. Upgraded the Faust B in the modeler, giving Faust IIa, and the Faust A and Faust B became Faust Ia and Faust IIb, respectively. I did the same procedure as before, and the Faust Ib upgraded to Faust IIa. And Faust Ia still upgraded to Faust Ib.

This all works as it should. When you start the game, does it say v1.1.9. I am wondering if I uploaded the wrong file. Also, make sure to have ATG v227B.

What do you mean by auto-upgrade?

[ernieschwitz]

auto upgrade is when you via the OOB screen click on a button to upgrade everything that can be upgraded.

EDIT: Perhaps this is a bug Vic introduced with his new version?

[Ormand]

OK, now I know what you mean. I never really used that feature as I kind of like to keep track of the supplies.

I did a test with this, and it worked as I think it is supposed to. That is, I started a random game and made a light tank model. I produced it and made a unit. I then researched Light Tank II and upgraded the model. In the OOB screen, I clicked the "Auto Upgrade" button, and it upgraded both the standard Light Tanks and the model. I also checked with improvements, and it seems to be working. I also checked if it was a unit identified in the TOE, and it also worked. If you want, you can send me the file, and I can take a look. Send me a PM and we can interchange contact info.

[ernieschwitz]

A complete use up of your supplies could happen if the SFT is set to upgrade to itself...

[LJBurstyn]

This time when I set up the game I remembered to change it to loadable for the editor.

Checked game.

Combat Engineer I is set to upgrade to Combat Engineer II. Combat Engineer II is set to upgrade to -1 (cannot be upgraded--I have not researched so the upgrade is not available yet).
My light tank is set to upgrade to itself.
My modeled dive bomber and fighter are set to upgrade to -1. (have not researched so upgrades are not available). Will research the upgrade and recheck to see if it upgrades correctly--is this done in the event code?.

EDIT: Checked the event code and SFT upgrade to is set in event code. Don't know what the error is as I did not really look at the coding. Just found where it says to change upgrade to for preexisting model to new model. I'll let the original coder correct it--as my fix would not be "official".

EDIT2: Restarted turn twice...
First time I upgraded model from NAMEFighter I to NAMEFighter II....old model points to new model...new model points to -1. Researched Fighter II.

Second time I upgraded model from NAMELITETANK I to NAMELITETANK II...old model points to new model...new model points to OLD model. Researched LIGHT TANK III. (NAMELITETANK I had been made with Light Tank II researched.)

[Ormand]

Actually, the new model pointing to -1 is not a problem. When you start with a model, say it is the Light Tank Faust, the model doesn't actually have a path to upgrade to yet, so it to will point to -1 for the upgrade. When you research Light Tank II, then in the modeler, you upgrade the Faust to Faust II. At this point, Faust I will show that it can upgrade to Faust II, and Faust II will have -1 for its upgrade. When you research Light Tank III, and upgrade the model to Faust III, then Faust II will show that it can upgrade to Faust III, and Faust III will have -1 for its upgrade. This is because the Faust IV SFT doesn't exist yet. The same should be for your Combat Engineer II.

[LJBurstyn]

ORIGINAL: Ormand

Actually, the new model pointing to -1 is not a problem. When you start with a model, say it is the Light Tank Faust, the model doesn't actually have a path to upgrade to yet, so it to will point to -1 for the upgrade. When you research Light Tank II, then in the modeler, you upgrade the Faust to Faust II. At this point, Faust I will show that it can upgrade to Faust II, and Faust II will have -1 for its upgrade. When you research Light Tank III, and upgrade the model to Faust III, then Faust II will show that it can upgrade to Faust III, and Faust III will have -1 for its upgrade. This is because the Faust IV SFT doesn't exist yet. The same should be for your Combat Engineer II.

But that is not what is happening. I agree that -1 is not the problem--what it is pointing to is the problem.
When I first upgrade to Faust I it points to Faust I as the upgrade NOT -1.
Faust I is pointing to Faust II after I research Light Tank X and upgrade to Faust II. Faust II is pointing to Faust I...not -1..
Combat Engineers work but tanks do not. It appears that Fighters also work.

EDIT: that means somewhere in the coding tank is set to point to itself instead of -1...and new versions are set to point to the wrong place.

Not sure why Dive Bombers are even in the model area since the model only uses the dive bomber research to upgrade the Dive Bomber Model...and does not use any of the improvements available in the research area (although ground attack might be nice).

[Ormand]

Funny, I don't see this behavior. It doesn't mean that it doesn't happen though. The only thing I can surmise is that it could be an initialization issue. My assumption is that as the model is created, several variables are copied over. Or they have an initial value, say zero, but in some cases, this isn't the actual default. At any rate, I modified things to v1.1.9b, which I have uploaded, where I explicitly set "upgrade to" for a new model to be -1. This hopefully will fix this issue.

As for dive bombers, when I get back in three weeks, I'll look at improving dive bomber capabilities. Right, now, the reason for them being models is the carrier dive bomber and carrier torpedo bomber alterations. This allows you to make "lighter" dive bomber to use on carriers as well as torpedo attack plans, which are specialized in attacking surface ships.

[LJBurstyn]

I downloaded version 1.1.9b and tanks still point to themselves to upgrade...

[Ormand]

Sorry, I don't see anything like this. Or I am completely misunderstanding you. When I create a light tank model, the first one has no upgrade possible. When, I research Light Tank II, I upgrade the model, and the previous SFT can be upgraded to this new SFT. Pretty much as I expect it to. Could you send me you save file to [edit: removed edit]? I can't guarantee that I can do much though, as I am kind off and on right now for the next three weeks. But, I will look.

[ernieschwitz]

I think he is talking about the Light Tank I, before a model is made.