Odds and Ends

[Hard Sarge]

I think the Shark mouth is great on most planes, most times, really giving it some feeling

most people, who don't follow this stuff, think that the Flying Tigers started it all

but the story was, that looking in a Mag (Life ?) they had a story and pictures of 112 Squadron in the Desert, and that is where they got the idea from

so, most people who do follow this stuff, think that the 112 Squadron started it all

me, I think anyplane with a deep chin, just begs to have some teeth or eyes added to it

(Werner Voss, with his DrI, the cowl had two openings on the front, that look like eyes, so, he put eyebrows and a mustaste on the front cowl of his plane)

so that said, I think anybody who had a plane with the right shape, all came up with the same ideas

[jcjordan]

It wouldn't surpise me if it actually started in WW1. What comes to my mind is a pic of some ace (German I think) where there's a face painted on the front of the cowl (eyes & mouth) & considering something like an Albatross made a good canvas for doing a shark mouth on. But you're right in that for WW2 it started in the desert & not the AVG.

[joey]

Shark teeth nose art did exist in WWI. There are a number of books on the subject of nose art. Most have the practice starting in WWI on biplanes.

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: jcjordan

It wouldn't surpise me if it actually started in WW1. What comes to my mind is a pic of some ace (German I think) where there's a face painted on the front of the cowl (eyes & mouth) & considering something like an Albatross made a good canvas for doing a shark mouth on. But you're right in that for WW2 it started in the desert & not the AVG.

Hmmmm, yea but...

that is the point I was going for, that is a very early model 109, way before the Kittyhawks got to the desert, but, will give you that the 112 may of been the first Squadron size unit to carry it, which would then give the AVG the line, that they were the first FG to carry them

the Stuka also looks good with teeth

[joey]

Huey helicopters and Tomcats looked real good with shark teeth also.

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: joey

Huey helicopters and Tomcats looked real good with shark teeth also.

the Cobra's yea, don't know, Jets just don't have the right chin for it

(they need to be Dragon like)

[jcjordan]

I think the A-10 has a very good nose for the shark & an even better bite for it too [:D]

[Hard Sarge]

ahhhh, but it is a wrap around mouth, the early 109, the stuka, the P-40, those all had chins, that made it look like a mouth

it is like looking at a P-51 with a sharkmouth and a P-40, the P-40 looks much better with it

(will admit, I really like the 109 G-6 with the eyes painted on the gun bulges, that looks good, of course, same plane with the shooting star on the bulges looks good too, or the 190 with the falcon painted across the cowl)

[joey]

Some planes just would not work with a shark mouth. I am not sure if a 190 is a good fit for a shark mouth. Or a P47 for that matter. I P40 did, but that might be the only thing it really had going for it besides great pilots!

[Hard Sarge]

I have seen some pic's of a 190 with a shark mouth, it didn't look too bad, better then on a 51 or spitfire (which i have also seen)

Hellcat is not too bad, but still don't look as good as the P-40 with it

[Hard Sarge]

190 with the Falcon (a little over fancy)

[Dixie]

[Hard Sarge]

LOL

would hate to be the ground crew man who had to brush all of them teeth !!!

I remember one story, later in the war, when the BC was bombing during the day, but still using the stream formation, one lanc was flying over France by itself and headed home, and basicly, sleeping at the wheel, they were safe, over friendly lines, when the pilot looked out the side window and seen a 190 flying right on the side of them, looking at the artwork (they had a nice babe on the side of the nose) the LW pilot seen him looking at him, gave him a happy thumbs up, then did a hurried Split-S as the gunners ran back to there guns

pilot stated in his report, that the 190 would had, had them cold, if he had wanted a kill, but he was more interested in checking out the artwork

[Hard Sarge]

you know, those stories are HARD to believe, but they happened too often, to all be lies

how many times did enemies join the wrong formation of planes, thinking they were friends, how many times did a LW plane land in England, or a English plane land in France

just was reading about one of the English pilots, had a hectic flight, and was happy to be home, seen a AF coming up and as he was coming down, noticed the traffic on the road, was on the wrong side, crank up to full power and turned around, he was still on the wrong side of the channel

133 Squadron, was lost on a mission, they spotted a city coming up on the coast, and didn't want to look sloppy to there English friends, tighten up there formation, and put on a fine fly pass, only it was Brest, kind of slow, and low, and the flak ripped them apart, think one plane made it to England to crashland, the rest, were either killed outright or taken POW, a whole squadron gone

[cap87]

It also happened to a B17 who probably wanted to finish the war earlier and thougth to land in switzerland but right after touching the ground and seeing the mc202 parked in the hangars they realized they were still in Italy..

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: Dixie

Geee, that wouldn't be one of the Lancs assigned to Tiger Force now would it ?

ducks and runs away

to be honest though, those almost look like P-40 chins on that Lanc

ohhh, think I will need to hide after that one, that is a Royal Sin to compare the Allison to a Merlin (even if it was a Packer)

[Hard Sarge]

ORIGINAL: cap87

It also happened to a B17 who probably wanted to finish the war earlier and thougth to land in switzerland but right after touching the ground and seeing the mc202 parked in the hangars they realized they were still in Italy..

yea, I think I read that one a little bit ago

along the same lines, was a LW 109 that landed at one of the 332nd FG airfields, stopped the plane, undid his straps and was climbing out of the plane, when he stopped and looked at all the Black Groundcrew running towards him, they said he was too shocked to figured out what was going on

(the LW called there Groundcrew, Blackmen, but this carried the words a little too far, Blackmen, who were Blackmen)

[Dixie]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

you know, those stories are HARD to believe, but they happened too often, to all be lies

how many times did enemies join the wrong formation of planes, thinking they were friends, how many times did a LW plane land in England, or a English plane land in France

That's how we got our hands on the 190. And Ju-88G with it's shiny new radar stuff. [:D]

Johnnie Johnson nearly got shot down in 1945 after he mistook a LW formation for his Spitfire wing.

[Dixie]

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

ORIGINAL: Dixie

Geee, that wouldn't be one of the Lancs assigned to Tiger Force now would it ?

ducks and runs away

to be honest though, those almost look like P-40 chins on that Lanc

ohhh, think I will need to hide after that one, that is a Royal Sin to compare the Allison to a Merlin (even if it was a Packer)

It's a Canadian B.X. Judging from the lack of guns on it and the one in the foreground it's after the Canadians had flown their aircraft back home.

EDIT: I knew I'd seen that aircraft somewehere before [:D]

[Hard Sarge]

I was going to ask about that